1                    CITY OF JACKSONVILLE

 

       2      LAND USE AND ZONING and PUBLIC HEALTH AND SAFETY

 

       3                  JOINT COMMITTEE MEETING

 

       4

 

       5

 

       6             Proceedings held on Tuesday, November 6,

 

       7   2007, commencing at 5:10 p.m., City Hall, Council

 

       8   Chambers, 1st Floor, Jacksonville, Florida, before

 

       9   Diane M. Tropia, a Notary Public in and for the State

 

      10   of Florida at Large.

 

      11

 

      12   LUZ MEMBERS PRESENT:

 

      13        MICHAEL CORRIGAN, Chair.

                CLAY YARBOROUGH, Vice Chair.

      14        RICHARD CLARK, Committee Member.

                MIA JONES, Committee Member.

      15        E. DENISE LEE, Committee Member.

                ART SHAD, Committee Member.

      16

 

      17

           PHS MEMBERS PRESENT:

      18

                KEVIN HYDE, Chair.

      19        MIA JONES, Vice Chair.

                JOHNNY GAFFNEY, Committee Member.

      20        RAY HOLT, Committee Member.

                STEPHEN JOOST, Committee Member.

      21        DON REDMAN, Committee Member.

                CLAY YARBOROUGH, Committee Member.

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           Diane M. Tropia, P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

                                                           2

 

 

       1   ALSO PRESENT:

 

       2        BILL BISHOP, City Council Member.

                JOHN CROFTS, Deputy Director, Planning Dept.

       3        SEAN KELLY, Planning and Development Dept.

                KEN AVERY, Planning and Development Dept.

       4        FOLKS HUXFORD, Planning and Development Dept.

                SHANNON ELLER, Office of General Counsel.

       5        JESSICA STEPHENS, Legislative Assistant.

                MERRIANE LAHMEUR, Legislative Assistant.

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           Diane M. Tropia, P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

                                                           3

 

 

       1                       I  N  D  E  X

 

       2

 

       3   ITEM/FILE NO.

           2007-984  RESO OF OPPOSITION TO EXTENSION OF ANY

       4             RUNWAY AT CRAIR AIRFIELD; DIRECTING

                     DISTRIBUTION OF RESO TO JACKSONVILLE

       5             AVIATION AUTHORITY AND DIRECTOR OF PLANNING

                     AND DEVELOPMENT.

       6             (COUNCILMEMBERS YARBOROUGH & BISHOP)

 

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           Diane M. Tropia, P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

                                                           4

 

 

       1                   P R O C E E D I N G S

 

       2   November 6, 2007                        5:10 p.m.

 

       3                         -  -  -

 

       4             THE CHAIRMAN:  Good evening, ladies and

 

       5        gentlemen.

 

       6             Tonight we have a little something

 

       7        different.  We're actually going to begin

 

       8        tonight's meeting with a joint Land Use and

 

       9        Zoning and Public Health and Safety Committee

 

      10        meeting to consider one bill.  The bill number

 

      11        is 2007-984.  If you have an LUZ agenda, it's

 

      12        item number 24 on your agenda.

 

      13             Several people have already asked me if

 

      14        there's a public hearing tonight, and there is

 

      15        not a public hearing on this bill tonight.  That

 

      16        public hearing was heard on October 23rd before

 

      17        the entire City Council, so your input was

 

      18        received by all the council members.

 

      19             The bill tonight will be debated by both

 

      20        the Land Use and Zoning and the Public Health

 

      21        and Safety Committee members.

 

      22             I know we have members of the Airport

 

      23        Authority board of directors that may be joining

 

      24        us, and we welcome them.

 

      25             We also have members of the public, and I'm

 

 

 

 

           Diane M. Tropia, P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

                                                           5

 

 

       1        sure that my fellow council members -- and the

 

       2        planning staff is here, as well as experts in

 

       3        the audience, and if you want to ask one of them

 

       4        a question during the debate of the bill, please

 

       5        feel free to ask them up.

 

       6             Having said that, I will let you know on

 

       7        the Land Use and Zoning Committee, the following

 

       8        members are present:  I am chairman, Michael

 

       9        Corrigan.  My vice chair, Clay Yarborough, is

 

      10        here.  Councilmember Richard Clark is here.

 

      11        Councilwoman Denise Lee is here.  Councilmember

 

      12        Art Shad is here.

 

      13             Councilmember Jack Webb has been excused,

 

      14        and I anticipate Councilwoman Mia Jones joining

 

      15        us in a minute.

 

      16             The chairman of the Public Health and

 

      17        Safety Committee is Councilmember Kevin Hyde,

 

      18        and I will now turn the floor to him for him to

 

      19        introduce his committee.

 

      20             MR. HYDE:  Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

 

      21             Mr. Redman; Mr. Holt; myself, Kevin Hyde;

 

      22        and Mr. Yarborough are here from our committee.

 

      23        Ms. Jones and Dr. Gaffney were upstairs and I

 

      24        think are on their way down as well, but we do

 

      25        have a quorum now.

 

 

 

 

           Diane M. Tropia, P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

                                                           6

 

 

       1             THE CHAIRMAN:  Okay.  Thank you.

 

       2             Now that we have the formalities out of the

 

       3        way, we need to get in the proper posture to be

 

       4        able to consider this bill, so I would entertain

 

       5        a motion on 2007-984.

 

       6             (Dr. Gaffney enters the proceedings.)

 

       7             MR. YARBOROUGH:  Move 2007-984.

 

       8             THE CHAIRMAN:  We have a motion.

 

       9             Do I have a second on the bill?

 

      10             MR. SHAD:  Second.

 

      11             THE CHAIRMAN:  We have a motion and a

 

      12        second from the Land Use and Zoning Committee.

 

      13             Councilmember Hyde.

 

      14             (Mr. Bishop enters the proceedings.)

 

      15             MR. HYDE:  I'll entertain a motion on -984

 

      16        from the committee.

 

      17             MR. YARBOROUGH:  Move the bill.

 

      18             MR. REDMAN:  Second.

 

      19             MR. HYDE:  Motion and a second on -984.

 

      20             THE CHAIRMAN:  Okay.  We are on the bill.

 

      21             I have a queue for only Land Use and Zoning

 

      22        committee members, so if will you raise your

 

      23        hand, I will just do a handwritten queue as we

 

      24        move forward.  So if you would like to speak on

 

      25        this bill, raise your hand.

 

 

 

 

           Diane M. Tropia, P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

                                                           7

 

 

       1             Councilmember Yarborough.

 

       2             MR. YARBOROUGH:  Thank you, Mr. Chairman

 

       3        and Mr. Chairman.  I appreciate the time to be

 

       4        here to talk about this.

 

       5             I guess to get started, I've got several

 

       6        documents here and I did have some questions

 

       7        to -- could we just ask who we have here from

 

       8        the Aviation Authority that may be willing to

 

       9        answer questions that we might have?

 

      10             Mr. Stewart, are you able to answer -- not

 

      11        just yet, but you -- or is Mr. Clark here

 

      12        tonight?

 

      13             MR. STEWART:  Mr. Clark is not here.

 

      14             MR. YARBOROUGH:  Okay.  So will you be able

 

      15        to answer questions if we have --

 

      16             MR. STEWART:  (Nods head.)

 

      17             MR. YARBOROUGH:  Okay.  I appreciate it.

 

      18        Thank you.

 

      19             Okay.  First, I just wanted to read into

 

      20        the record -- I mentioned this at our Rules

 

      21        Committee meeting yesterday morning,

 

      22        Mr. Chairman -- a letter that we -- a letter

 

      23        that was sent to Alberta Hipps and also Matt

 

      24        Carlucci in May of 2001, and it was written by

 

      25        Mr. Fiorentino, who was the --

 

 

 

 

           Diane M. Tropia, P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

                                                           8

 

 

       1             MR. BISHOP:  Excuse me, Mr. Chairman, real

 

       2        quick.  I'm sorry to interrupt real quick.

 

       3             You had asked for Mr. Clark to identify

 

       4        Airport Authority members that are here.  I

 

       5        wanted to recognize that John Falconetti is in

 

       6        the audience tonight.

 

       7             THE CHAIRMAN:  Thank you, Councilman

 

       8        Bishop.

 

       9             And let the record reflect that

 

      10        Councilmember Bishop has joined us,

 

      11        Councilman Gaffney has joined us.  I think

 

      12        that's it.

 

      13             Okay.  Go ahead, Councilman Yarborough.

 

      14        Sorry.

 

      15             MR. YARBOROUGH:  That's all right.

 

      16             Okay.  I just wanted to read into the

 

      17        record, just as we get started here, a letter

 

      18        that Mr. Fiorentino had written as chairman of

 

      19        the board, May 29th, 2001, and this was four

 

      20        months after the Port Authority had done the

 

      21        resolution which said that they would

 

      22        discontinue all of their efforts to lengthen the

 

      23        runway at Craig Airfield, which was unanimously

 

      24        adopted by the Port Authority board at that

 

      25        time.

 

 

 

 

           Diane M. Tropia, P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

                                                           9

 

 

       1             The letter says, "As board chairman, let me

 

       2        reiterate that there are no plans, either now or

 

       3        in the future, to extend the runway at Craig

 

       4        Airport.  In fact, at today's board meeting, we

 

       5        voted unanimously to return $469,500 to the

 

       6        Florida Department of Transportation for land

 

       7        acquisition at Craig Airport.  This money would

 

       8        have been used for future development of Craig

 

       9        Airport and additional land acquisition to be

 

      10        used as a buffer to protect the boundaries of

 

      11        the airport should there have been a runway

 

      12        expansion.

 

      13             "As to the notion that a new board would

 

      14        not be bound by the attached resolution, which I

 

      15        might add was unanimously adopted by the board,

 

      16        I believe that any review of the issue would

 

      17        result in the same conclusion by a new board.

 

      18        Personally, I hope both new boards will honor

 

      19        the past actions of the previous board."

 

      20             And I'll read the final paragraph before I

 

      21        comment on this.

 

      22             "Over the past year, the board has worked

 

      23        hard to improve communications and credibility

 

      24        with the City Council and the community.  We are

 

      25        sensitive to the concerns of the community.

 

 

 

 

           Diane M. Tropia, P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

                                                           10

 

 

       1             "In the case of Craig Airport, we have

 

       2        listened to the community, and that is the

 

       3        reason we have abandoned efforts to expand the

 

       4        runway.  The board is dedicated to being good

 

       5        fiduciaries of the public trust and we intend to

 

       6        maintain that trust."

 

       7             So basically what this letter does -- and,

 

       8        again, it was drafted over the board chairman's

 

       9        signature -- is establish that the board, even

 

      10        though, knowing how the system works and even as

 

      11        a City Council, when new members come in and new

 

      12        councils continue on into the future, obviously

 

      13        legislation can be changed that was enacted, you

 

      14        know, prior to future councils coming.

 

      15             But this basically establishes, colleagues,

 

      16        that it was the intent then of the board at that

 

      17        time that they would also put something in place

 

      18        that would -- they said they would like it to be

 

      19        in perpetuity, but that was factored into their

 

      20        reasoning for opposing it at that time as well.

 

      21        And we'll get into some of the reasons of that

 

      22        in just a minute, but that was factored in, and

 

      23        I just thought that would be important to

 

      24        mention as we get into this debate.

 

      25             (Ms. Jones enters the proceedings.)

 

 

 

 

           Diane M. Tropia, P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

                                                           11

 

 

       1             MR. YARBOROUGH:  The other thing that's of

 

       2        paramount importance here -- or that's fairly

 

       3        important is the fact that it says at today's

 

       4        meeting we voted unanimously to return nearly a

 

       5        half a million dollars to FDOT for land

 

       6        acquisition at Craig Airport, and that money

 

       7        could have been used for future development

 

       8        should there have ever been a runway expansion.

 

       9             So not only was the word given by the Port

 

      10        Authority board at the time that they wouldn't

 

      11        expand the runway, money was also sent back to

 

      12        the Department of Transportation that then could

 

      13        have been used to provide more buffer space or

 

      14        more land acquisition, if they had needed that,

 

      15        if they had decided to move forward.

 

      16             Now, if that money was given back, a few

 

      17        questions, I guess, would be -- just for us to

 

      18        percolate on a little bit would be, how much

 

      19        would that be in today's dollars?  Are they

 

      20        going to try to get more land now if they expand

 

      21        the runway to use for that development to put

 

      22        around the boundaries of the airport to protect

 

      23        it?  Where will that money come from?  And just

 

      24        issues like that.

 

      25             And we don't have answers to those

 

 

 

 

           Diane M. Tropia, P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

                                                           12

 

 

       1        questions.  In fact, we haven't even heard

 

       2        anything about that.

 

       3             So I just wanted to mention that first, and

 

       4        then, Mr. Stewart, if you would come up to the

 

       5        microphone, I've got several questions I would

 

       6        like to ask you as we get into the issue a

 

       7        little bit.

 

       8             (Mr. Stewart approaches the podium.)

 

       9             MR. YARBOROUGH:  Thank you for being here

 

      10        too, by the way.

 

      11             MR. STEWART:  Michael Stewart, 10218

 

      12        Shore View Drive North, Jacksonville, Florida

 

      13        32218.

 

      14             MR. YARBOROUGH:  Thank you.

 

      15             THE CHAIRMAN:  And, Councilman Yarborough,

 

      16        before you start --

 

      17             MR. YARBOROUGH:  Yes, sir.

 

      18             THE CHAIRMAN:  -- let me, for the record,

 

      19        indicate that Councilmember Joost has joined us,

 

      20        and he's on the Public Health and Safety

 

      21        Committee, and Councilwoman Mia Jones has joined

 

      22        us, and she is on both Public Health and Safety

 

      23        and LUZ.

 

      24             Thank you.

 

      25             MR. YARBOROUGH:  Thank you.

 

 

 

 

           Diane M. Tropia, P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

                                                           13

 

 

       1             Mr. Stewart, thank you, again, for being

 

       2        here.  Appreciate it.

 

       3             The master plan that Craig Field is

 

       4        operating on right now, is there a 2006 or a

 

       5        2007 plan or what plan are we operating on for

 

       6        what takes place at Craig Field right now?  If

 

       7        you could answer that question.

 

       8             MR. STEWART:  I'm sorry.  Would you repeat

 

       9        the question, please.

 

      10             MR. YARBOROUGH:  Is there a master plan for

 

      11        Craig Airport?

 

      12             MR. STEWART:  Correct.  It was approved, I

 

      13        think, in 2001.

 

      14             MR. YARBOROUGH:  In 2001.

 

      15             Was it before or after the resolution and

 

      16        action were done by the board to not extend the

 

      17        runway at Craig Field?

 

      18             MR. STEWART:  I couldn't give you the

 

      19        specific date of the approval of the master

 

      20        plan.

 

      21             MR. YARBOROUGH:  Okay.

 

      22             MR. STEWART:  You probably have that there.

 

      23             MR. YARBOROUGH:  On the bottom, it says

 

      24        October 2001.

 

      25             MR. STEWART:  Okay.  Mr. Chairman -- or

 

 

 

 

           Diane M. Tropia, P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

                                                           14

 

 

       1        through Clay Yarborough, I know there's been

 

       2        some conversations with a board member, John

 

       3        Falconetti, with Councilman Bill Bishop, and I

 

       4        don't know if it would be appropriate at this

 

       5        time for Councilman Bishop to talk about that or

 

       6        if Mr. John Falconetti would come up.

 

       7             MR. YARBOROUGH:  Mr. Stewart, I believe I

 

       8        was asking you some questions, if I could

 

       9        continue with that, if that would --

 

      10             MR. STEWART:  Yes, that would be fine.

 

      11             MR. YARBOROUGH:  Thank you.  Okay.  Thank

 

      12        you for answering that.

 

      13             THE CHAIRMAN:  Councilman Yarborough, just

 

      14        to clarify.

 

      15             MR. YARBOROUGH:  Yes.

 

      16             THE CHAIRMAN:  If Mr. Stewart doesn't know

 

      17        the answers or Mr. Falconetti, then --

 

      18             MR. YARBOROUGH:  Sure.  That's fine.  Just

 

      19        so we can -- we can do that.  That's fine.

 

      20             Mr. Stewart, if the Aviation Authority were

 

      21        to lengthen the runway at Craig Field, would the

 

      22        Authority purchase any more land as part of

 

      23        that?  Would it need to acquire more land or

 

      24        purchase more --

 

      25             MR. STEWART:  No property would be needed

 

 

 

 

           Diane M. Tropia, P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

                                                           15

 

 

       1        for the purchase -- I mean, for extension of

 

       2        Runway 32, even inclusive of the runway

 

       3        protection zones associated with that runway

 

       4        extension.

 

       5             MR. YARBOROUGH:  Okay.  What is the primary

 

       6        reason for the Authority wanting to extend the

 

       7        runway at Craig Field?

 

       8             MR. STEWART:  The primary reason is safety.

 

       9             MR. YARBOROUGH:  Has that always been the

 

      10        reason that the Authority has wanted to increase

 

      11        the runway at Craig Field?

 

      12             MR. STEWART:  Yes.

 

      13             MR. YARBOROUGH:  It's always just been

 

      14        safety?

 

      15             MR. STEWART:  Not just safety, but it's --

 

      16        safety has been the primary reason.

 

      17             MR. YARBOROUGH:  Well, I guess in years

 

      18        past, what other issues have factored into

 

      19        wanting to extend the runway if it's not just

 

      20        safety?

 

      21             MR. STEWART:  In addition, to take care of

 

      22        the growth in general aviation that is coming to

 

      23        the airport.  The airport has grown and the

 

      24        infrastructure has to be improved to accept that

 

      25        growth.

 

 

 

 

           Diane M. Tropia, P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

                                                           16

 

 

       1             MR. YARBOROUGH:  If the runway were to be

 

       2        extended, would it allow for larger craft to

 

       3        come in at Craig?

 

       4             MR. STEWART:  Larger --

 

       5             MR. YARBOROUGH:  Larger airplanes.

 

       6             MR. STEWART:  Not any larger than can come

 

       7        in right now.

 

       8             MR. YARBOROUGH:  So they would not be

 

       9        larger than the current --

 

      10             MR. STEWART:  Well, the current craft are

 

      11        rated for 60,000-pound dual wheel, and that's

 

      12        the rating of the actual runway, and that rating

 

      13        will not change.  The design of the extension

 

      14        will be six inches of asphalt, the same as the

 

      15        existing runway is today.

 

      16             MR. YARBOROUGH:  Okay.  I have a -- thank

 

      17        you for that answer.

 

      18             Again, going back to 2000 just for a

 

      19        minute, members.  There was a letter sent by a

 

      20        lady, Ms. Plummer (phonetic), who lived in the

 

      21        community over there near the airport, to

 

      22        Mr. Gary Duncan, who, at the time, was the

 

      23        aviation manager at Craig Field, and one of the

 

      24        questions that she asked was noise related, but

 

      25        in answering her question about noise -- I'll

 

 

 

 

           Diane M. Tropia, P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

                                                           17

 

 

       1        read you the paragraph.  He did say that if the

 

       2        runway was extended, then larger craft would be

 

       3        able to come in.

 

       4             It says, "Aircraft departing Runway 14

 

       5        heading southeast will start their rollout at

 

       6        the same point they do today, with or without an

 

       7        extension, and will be near or at the same

 

       8        elevation they are today when they cross the

 

       9        airport boundary."

 

      10             And here's the sentence here, it says,

 

      11        "Factoring in larger aircraft, which will be

 

      12        able to use Craig in the future with a longer

 

      13        runway, the noise study indicates that the noise

 

      14        will remain the same as it is today near the

 

      15        southeastern point of the airport."

 

      16             And, again, that was the general aviation

 

      17        manager of the Authority at that time.  So,

 

      18        according to that letter, if the runway

 

      19        extension were to happen, then larger airplanes

 

      20        would be able to come in.

 

      21             MR. STEWART:  Well, I can't comment on the

 

      22        letter not having it, but I know what is being

 

      23        proposed as far as the runway extension includes

 

      24        a displacement of a thousand feet at each end,

 

      25        which will definitely impact the noise contours,

 

 

 

 

           Diane M. Tropia, P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

                                                           18

 

 

       1        and they would be different than the time frame

 

       2        of what you were looking at.

 

       3             MR. YARBOROUGH:  Okay.  Thank you,

 

       4        Mr. Stewart.

 

       5             Just for a few minutes, members, I'd like

 

       6        to -- from the 2006 statistical package from the

 

       7        City's Planning and Development Department --

 

       8        you know, we've heard from the Authority that a

 

       9        lot has changed over time because, you know, we

 

      10        need to do -- we need to be open to the fact

 

      11        that maybe there should be a runway extension

 

      12        now because times change, sometimes things need

 

      13        to be done differently.

 

      14             Well, a lot has changed in the East

 

      15        Arlington area since the resolution was done

 

      16        that said the airport runway would not be

 

      17        extended.  We now have -- you know, before the

 

      18        Dames Point Bridge -- I'm reading from this

 

      19        here.  The Dames Point Bridge and State Road 9A

 

      20        were completed back before it was necessary to

 

      21        pay tolls on the Mathews and Trout River

 

      22        Bridges.  Now the time and ease of reaching JIA

 

      23        are considerably changed, at the current time,

 

      24        because we have quicker ways to get there.

 

      25             The other thing is we have spent -- I don't

 

 

 

 

           Diane M. Tropia, P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

                                                           19

 

 

       1        know how much it's been, but over the past

 

       2        several years we've invested heavily into the

 

       3        infrastructure and the transportation system out

 

       4        near Cecil Field, and so that should also be

 

       5        considered as opposed to lengthening the runway

 

       6        at Craig Field if more runway is needed.  And if

 

       7        it's for safety reasons, that's also a viable

 

       8        option that should be considered as well.

 

       9             But just a few of these statistics quickly

 

      10        and then I'm sure Mr. Bishop would like to speak

 

      11        for a few minutes.

 

      12             Just between 2000 and 2006, 12,000 new

 

      13        residential building permits were issued for

 

      14        this area.  This is in the vicinity of Craig

 

      15        Field.  These are new houses; these aren't just

 

      16        people.  So 12,000 new residential building

 

      17        permits.

 

      18             And the fact remains that the Port

 

      19        Authority did do this resolution.  A letter was

 

      20        written, it said we're not going to extend the

 

      21        runway.  And I guess the big sticking point on

 

      22        this with me, more than what all the numbers may

 

      23        say as far as that is, a word was given that the

 

      24        runway would not be extended, and residents and

 

      25        others have now moved into this area under the

 

 

 

 

           Diane M. Tropia, P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

                                                           20

 

 

       1        notion that the runway would not be extended.

 

       2             I know times change.  I know things

 

       3        change.  I know it's part of a growing city.  We

 

       4        need to be open to new ideas and economics and

 

       5        all of that, but the point is a word was given.

 

       6             And if safety was so important back in

 

       7        2000, then why did the Authority do a resolution

 

       8        saying we will abandon our efforts to extend the

 

       9        runway if safety was so important?  If it was

 

      10        that important, it wouldn't have mattered what

 

      11        the political unrestlessness of the day was,

 

      12        they would have stuck with the safety argument

 

      13        back then.

 

      14             And we have heard that safety is the

 

      15        primary issue, safety is the number one issue.

 

      16        Well, then, why wasn't that adhered to?  Why

 

      17        didn't they stay with that before?  That's one

 

      18        thing to think about.

 

      19             So people -- you know, people moved in.

 

      20             The other thing is we had a debate not long

 

      21        ago about how Cecil Field may change if the Navy

 

      22        were to return.  If that was something --

 

      23             Actually, that does bring a question to

 

      24        mind, Mr. Stewart.  Did the Aviation Authority

 

      25        take a position on whether or not the Navy

 

 

 

 

           Diane M. Tropia, P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

                                                           21

 

 

       1        should return to Cecil Field?

 

       2             MR. STEWART:  Not to my knowledge.

 

       3             MR. YARBOROUGH:  There was no position

 

       4        taken?

 

       5             MR. STEWART:  Not to my knowledge.

 

       6             MR. YARBOROUGH:  Okay.  And yet the --

 

       7        okay.  I appreciate that.  I wasn't sure, so

 

       8        thank you.

 

       9             Mr. Chairman, I'll relinquish some of my

 

      10        time here just for a minute if Mr. Bishop or

 

      11        other members would like to jump in, and then

 

      12        I'll speak again in a few minutes.

 

      13             THE CHAIRMAN:  Okay.  Thank you.

 

      14             The only other --

 

      15             MR. YARBOROUGH:  Thank you, Mr. Stewart.

 

      16             THE CHAIRMAN:  The only other speaker I

 

      17        have on the queue right now is Councilmember

 

      18        Bishop.

 

      19             MR. BISHOP:  Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

 

      20             The issues that Councilman Yarborough have

 

      21        talked about are a lot of the issues of why this

 

      22        is such a hot topic in our part of the world

 

      23        over there.

 

      24             What I would like to talk about at this

 

      25        point is something that has been -- I have

 

 

 

 

           Diane M. Tropia, P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

                                                           22

 

 

       1        had -- Mr. Stewart alluded to something at the

 

       2        beginning of his talk when Mr. Yarborough was

 

       3        asking questions that -- over the last week

 

       4        I have had a couple of conversations with

 

       5        Mr. Falconetti, and -- if you wouldn't mind

 

       6        coming up to the microphone, I would appreciate

 

       7        it.

 

       8             MR. FALCONETTI:  (Complies.)

 

       9             MR. BISHOP:  Because of the nature of

 

      10        Sunshine laws, obviously I haven't been able to

 

      11        apprise Councilman Yarborough, my cosponsor on

 

      12        this resolution, fully on this just due to the

 

      13        nature of timing.  And so I apologize if any of

 

      14        this is a surprise, but I think it's important.

 

      15             Because of the issues that we've just been

 

      16        talking about, you can see why this is such an

 

      17        important issue.  And in the discussions that

 

      18        I've had with Mr. Falconetti, I believe that

 

      19        he's in a position to talk about some,

 

      20        hopefully, new developments on this issue with

 

      21        the idea that we could hopefully resolve some of

 

      22        these problems in a less acrimonious manner and

 

      23        hopefully be a little more productive on how we

 

      24        use our time for the betterment of the city.

 

      25             Mr. Falconetti, do you have anything you

 

 

 

 

           Diane M. Tropia, P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

                                                           23

 

 

       1        want to add to that?

 

       2             MR. FALCONETTI:  Councilman, thank you very

 

       3        much.

 

       4             Mr. Chairman, distinguished members of the

 

       5        council, thank you for allowing us to be before

 

       6        you this evening.

 

       7             Councilman Yarborough, I --

 

       8             THE CHAIRMAN:  Mr. Falconetti, if you'd

 

       9        give your name and address for the record,

 

      10        please.

 

      11             MR. FALCONETTI:  I'm sorry.

 

      12             THE CHAIRMAN:  You've given your name.

 

      13        Just your address, please.

 

      14             MR. FALCONETTI:  I've been here so often

 

      15        lately, I figured you-all had me on speed dial.

 

      16             John Falconetti, 505 Lancaster Street.

 

      17             Councilman Yarborough, I respect and admire

 

      18        your passion, and that certainly came through in

 

      19        this proceeding and so forth.  I feel equally as

 

      20        passionate about this issue in supporting a

 

      21        runway extension at Craig Field.  And I stand

 

      22        before you confident in the fact that we have a

 

      23        proposal that answers many of the questions, if

 

      24        not all -- in fact, all of the questions that

 

      25        you and many others might have throughout this

 

 

 

 

           Diane M. Tropia, P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

                                                           24

 

 

       1        process.

 

       2             However, I think we can all acknowledge

 

       3        that the process is as important as the

 

       4        indecision.  Whichever way all of you may vote,

 

       5        I think it's important to each of you,

 

       6        especially those of you that either don't reside

 

       7        in the district or even far from the district,

 

       8        feel comfortable when you put your head down on

 

       9        the pillow at night that you've made the

 

      10        decision that's best for this community.

 

      11             So in conversations with Councilman

 

      12        Bishop -- and certainly it's been a feeling of

 

      13        his and perhaps others that are in opposition of

 

      14        the extension, that the Aviation Authority has

 

      15        not proceeded with a fully transparent and

 

      16        engaging process with the public.

 

      17             While I feel as if we have had community

 

      18        forums, and I -- and I certainly feel as if we

 

      19        have reached out, we have agreed to do more.

 

      20        And Councilman Bishop and I have begun dialogues

 

      21        and we'll continue on a very aggressive time

 

      22        line to create a structure that will allow for

 

      23        this kind of fair and open debate and dialogue.

 

      24             And while the Aviation Authority will not

 

      25        delay in its activity in bringing this extension

 

 

 

 

           Diane M. Tropia, P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

                                                           25

 

 

       1        before you, I hope that this good-faith effort

 

       2        on both of our parts will certainly illuminate

 

       3        this process and we hope will bring value.

 

       4             So those are the conversations that we've

 

       5        had.  And, you know, again, as equally as proud

 

       6        and as much as I admire Councilman Yarborough's

 

       7        passion for this, Councilman Bishop, I

 

       8        appreciate you reaching out to us and wanting to

 

       9        look at this -- look at this box from all sides.

 

      10             Thank you.

 

      11             MR. BISHOP:  Thank you.

 

      12             Just to put some of this in perspective, I

 

      13        believe that the process we're going through

 

      14        right now is highly unproductive for both sides

 

      15        of the fence because at the end of the day if

 

      16        the process goes through as it's going now and

 

      17        we win, then I'm confident in a very short time

 

      18        the Airport Authority is going to be back again

 

      19        with this issue.  Once again, we'll have to

 

      20        fight it all over again.

 

      21             If we lose, then we've got a whole 'nother

 

      22        subset of issues out there that I even -- I

 

      23        hesitate to even fathom where that would go.

 

      24             Regardless of the end result, it's an

 

      25        unproductive exercise and it's not good for the

 

 

 

 

           Diane M. Tropia, P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

                                                           26

 

 

       1        City.

 

       2             What I take Mr. Falconetti's offer as is an

 

       3        extension of the offer that I offered to

 

       4        Mr. Clark back -- at this point, I guess

 

       5        probably close to a month ago, that -- I believe

 

       6        that if both sides can take a step back without

 

       7        hammers over each other's heads, we might reach

 

       8        some sort of a mutually-agreeable solution here

 

       9        that gets both sides maybe not everything they

 

      10        want but certainly what they need for the

 

      11        long-term benefit of the city.

 

      12             I'm also understanding, because of the time

 

      13        line of things, that Mr. Falconetti cannot

 

      14        commit the Airport Authority unilaterally to

 

      15        things.  He's one board member.  I trust what

 

      16        he's saying is that he will take this back to

 

      17        the Airport Authority to get them to come to the

 

      18        table in a mutually-beneficial manner.

 

      19             And because of that belief, I'm willing --

 

      20        what I would do is suggest that we postpone this

 

      21        resolution or defer it one cycle to give us the

 

      22        opportunity to have those discussions.  And

 

      23        if at the end of that time we reach a

 

      24        mutually-agreeable methodology to move forward,

 

      25        then I think that's in the benefit of

 

 

 

 

           Diane M. Tropia, P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

                                                           27

 

 

       1        everybody.

 

       2             If we don't and we agree that we're not

 

       3        going anywhere, then we're right back where we

 

       4        are and we can proceed along the lines that

 

       5        we're doing right now with full gusto that we've

 

       6        demonstrated thus far today, because while you

 

       7        passionately believe the runway is the right

 

       8        thing to do, I'm equally passionate that I don't

 

       9        think it is.

 

      10             And I think at this point we're both in a

 

      11        posture of trying to convince each other of the

 

      12        merits of our argument, and -- but at the end of

 

      13        the day -- I've said this before, aviation is a

 

      14        viable industry, it's a necessary industry for

 

      15        this city.  How do we go about doing it properly

 

      16        so that we protect the interests of all citizens

 

      17        of this city, not just those that fly planes and

 

      18        fly jets out of the airport or not just those

 

      19        that live somewhere else.

 

      20             The people that live around that airport

 

      21        have a vital stake in this issue, to the same

 

      22        degree as anybody else in the city, and their

 

      23        interests need to be protected as well and we

 

      24        need to make sure that they are.

 

      25             And so that's why I welcome this

 

 

 

 

           Diane M. Tropia, P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

                                                           28

 

 

       1        opportunity and look forward to working with

 

       2        you, Mr. Falconetti, and the Airport Authority

 

       3        going forward over the next couple of weeks,

 

       4        hopefully, that we can establish the ground

 

       5        rules for this dialogue and make a productive

 

       6        exercise of it.

 

       7             And I guess in closing, then, I would

 

       8        suggest to the joint committees that we defer

 

       9        this bill for one cycle and let that process

 

      10        play out.

 

      11             THE CHAIRMAN:  Okay.  I do have

 

      12        Councilmember Hyde on my queue.  So we'll go to

 

      13        Councilmember Hyde, and then I have a question

 

      14        for Mr. Falconetti.

 

      15             MR. HYDE:  Thank you.

 

      16             Mr. Bishop, I appreciate your offer and I

 

      17        think that the spirit of compromise that both

 

      18        parties are showing here is exactly what needs

 

      19        to happen.

 

      20             As chairman of the committee, I will defer

 

      21        that.  And I will look to my committee members,

 

      22        is there any strong opposition to me deferring

 

      23        it for one cycle?

 

      24             COMMITTEE MEMBERS:  (No response.)

 

      25             MR. HYDE:  We defer it in PHS.

 

 

 

 

           Diane M. Tropia, P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

                                                           29

 

 

       1             THE CHAIRMAN:  Okay.  Mr. Falconetti,

 

       2        before the Land Use and Zoning Committee defers,

 

       3        do you concur with the deferral and support the

 

       4        deferral as described by Councilmember Bishop?

 

       5             MR. FALCONETTI:  We do.

 

       6             Just to reiterate and really just to,

 

       7        again, restate the conversations that Councilman

 

       8        Bishop and I have had.  If nothing else, I hope

 

       9        the community, certainly the Aviation Authority,

 

      10        and the City Council sees that this is a

 

      11        good-faith effort on both parties to realize

 

      12        what hopefully would be a win/win for the City

 

      13        of Jacksonville and for the communities.

 

      14             So we recognize that -- hope it's

 

      15        recognized as that, and we'll pursue this in

 

      16        good faith.  That I promise you.

 

      17             THE CHAIRMAN:  Okay.  Thank you,

 

      18        Mr. Falconetti.

 

      19             Based on that request of one of the

 

      20        cosponsors and the confirmation by the Airport

 

      21        Authority board of directors member --

 

      22        Councilman Yarborough, I know that you're a

 

      23        cosponsor of the bill.  Obviously, as cosponsor,

 

      24        let me give you the right to give your opinion

 

      25        on the deferral.

 

 

 

 

           Diane M. Tropia, P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

                                                           30

 

 

       1             MR. YARBOROUGH:  I support the deferral,

 

       2        Mr. Chairman.

 

       3             THE CHAIRMAN:  Okay.  Thank you.

 

       4             This item will be deferred in LUZ as well,

 

       5        and I appreciate Councilman Bishop, Councilman

 

       6        Yarborough and the Airport Authority willing to

 

       7        get together and try to work out a compromise on

 

       8        this issue.

 

       9             Based on that, the joint meeting between

 

      10        the Land Use and Zoning Committee and the Public

 

      11        Health and Safety Committee is adjourned and we

 

      12        will convene the Land Use and Zoning Committee

 

      13        meeting at this time.

 

      14             Thank you, everyone, for being here.  Thank

 

      15        you, Mr. Falconetti and Mr. Stewart.

 

      16             MR. FALCONETTI:  Thank you.

 

      17             THE CHAIRMAN:  Okay.  We're going to wait

 

      18        just a couple of minutes and then we'll start

 

      19        back up again.

 

      20             (The above proceedings were adjourned at

 

      21        5:35 p.m.)

 

      22                         -  -  -

 

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           Diane M. Tropia, P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

                                                           31

 

 

       1                  C E R T I F I C A T E

 

       2

 

       3   STATE OF FLORIDA:

 

       4   COUNTY OF DUVAL :

 

       5

 

       6             I, Diane M. Tropia, certify that I was

 

       7   authorized to and did stenographically report the

 

       8   foregoing proceedings and that the transcript is a

 

       9   true and complete record of my stenographic notes.

 

      10             Dated this 11th day of November, 2007.

 

      11

 

      12

 

      13

 

      14                                 Diane M. Tropia

 

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           Diane M. Tropia, P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203