1 CITY OF
2 LAND USE AND ZONING
3 COMMITTEE
4
5
6 Proceedings held on Tuesday, January 6,
7 2009, commencing at 5:03 p.m., City Hall, Council
8 Chambers, 1st Floor,
9 Diane M. Tropia, a Notary Public in and for the State
10 of
11
12 PRESENT:
13 ART GRAHAM, Chair.
STEPHEN JOOST, Vice Chair.
14 REGGIE BROWN, Committee Member.
JACK WEBB, Committee Member.
15 DON REDMAN, Committee Member.
16
ALSO PRESENT:
17
JOHN CROFTS, Deputy Director, Planning Dept.
18 SEAN KELLY, Chief, Current Planning.
19 RICK CAMPBELL, Research Assistant.
MARILYN ALLEN, Legislative Assistant.
20 MERRIANE LAHMEUR, Legislative Assistant.
21 - - -
22
23
24
25
Diane M.
Tropia,
2
1 P R O C E E D I N G S
2 January 6, 2009 5:03 p.m.
3 - - -
4 THE CHAIRMAN: Good afternoon, everybody.
5 Let the record show it is about 5:03 on
6 Tuesday, January 6th, and this is the Land Use
7 and Zoning Committee meeting.
8 And if we could start over here on my
9 right, please introduce yourself.
10 MR. CROFTS: John Crofts, Planning and
11 Development Department.
12 MR. KELLY: Sean Kelly, Planning.
13 MS. ELLER: Shannon Eller, General
14 Counsel's Office.
15 THE CHAIRMAN: I'm Art Graham, City
16 Council, District 13.
17 MR. JOOST: Stephen Joost, City Council,
18 Group 3 at-large.
19 MR. BROWN: Reginald Brown, District 10.
20 MR. WEBB: Jack Webb, City Council,
21 District 6.
22 THE CHAIRMAN: And let the record show that
23 we have an excused absence for Ray Holt, and I'm
24 assuming that Don Redman will be down directly
25 because I hadn't heard anything from his
Diane M. Tropia,
3
1 office.
2 That all being said, let's go through --
3 and I will tell you guys, I've been making a
4 practice to tell you guys bills that we're going
5 to take action on so you're not sitting out here
6 listening to all this and realize we're not
7 voting on your bill tonight. So we're going to
8 go through the agenda. I'll tell you the ones
9 we're going to defer and the ones we're actually
10 going to take action on.
11 The first page, 2005-1228, 2006-24, and
12 2006-220 are all deferred.
13 The second page, 2006-658 and 2007-581 are
14 deferred.
15 I'm sorry. 2007-1086 there's a public
16 hearing, but we're taking no action.
17 2008-414, it's deferred, -416 is deferred,
18 -418 is deferred.
19 (Mr. Redman enters the proceedings.)
20 THE CHAIRMAN: Top of page 5. 2008-517,
21 -541, -542, -546 all being deferred, or no
22 action rather.
23 Top of page 6. -549, -550, -552, -562, all
24 no action or deferred.
25 Page 7. We are voting on --
Diane M.
Tropia,
4
1 MR. CROFTS: Mr. Chairman, I'm sorry to
2 interrupt. Item 17 does have a public hearing
3 for your information.
4 THE CHAIRMAN: Yes. They're either
5 deferred or no action.
6 MR. CROFTS: Okay.
7 THE CHAIRMAN: I just want to let people
8 know that we're not voting on it.
9 Top of page 7. -565 we are voting on that
10 today, regardless of what Mr. Webb says, and we
11 are not voting on it again in this committee
12 after today.
13 2008-784, we're not taking any action.
14 -799, we're voting that one out today.
15 And Ms. Lee is here. We're actually taking that
16 one up first.
17 Ms. Lee, how are you today?
18 MS. LEE: I've got two -- three on the
19 agenda, and two I'm probably not going to take
20 up.
21 THE CHAIRMAN: Okay. Bottom of page 7.
22 -840, we're taking no action.
23 Page 8. -854 we're voting on; -880, no
24 action; -890 is being withdrawn; -891 is being
25 withdrawn; -893 we're taking no action; -935,
Diane M.
Tropia,
5
1 we're voting that one out; -936, we're taking no
2 action; -984 we're voting out; -985 we're voting
3 out; -986, no action; -987 we're voting out;
4 -988 we're voting out; -989 we're voting out.
5 And all the rest of these -- -1024, -1025,
6 -1026, -1027, -1028, -1029, -1030, -1031,
7 -1032, -1033, -1047, -1048 -- are all deferred.
8 -1048 -- I'm sorry. -1049, we're taking
9 action; -1050, we're not taking any action;
10 -1051 we're voting out today, taking action.
11 And then the rest of these, -1060, -1061,
12 -1069, -1070, -1071, -1072, -1073, -4, -5, -6,
13 -7, and -1098 and -1108 are all second and
14 rereferred.
15 Was that as difficult as it sounds?
16 Okay. That all being said, bottom of
17 page 3, 2007-1086. We'll open the public
18 hearing.
19 Seeing no speakers, we'll continue that
20 public hearing and take no further action.
21 Top of page 5. 2008-517, we'll open that
22 public hearing.
23 Seeing no speakers, we'll continue that
24 public hearing and take no further action.
25 Middle of page 6 -- bottom of page 6, I'm
Diane M.
Tropia,
6
1 sorry. 2008-562, we'll open that public
2 hearing.
3 We have one speaker, Richard Kravitz.
4 MR. KRAVITZ: Just for questions.
5 THE CHAIRMAN: He's here for questions
6 only.
7 Seeing no questions for Mr. Kravitz, we'll
8 continue that public hearing and take no further
9 action.
10 Top of page 7 -- I'm sorry. Before we do
11 that, Ms. Lee, I forgot your bill.
12 Middle of page 7, 2008-799. We will open
13 that public hearing.
14 MS. LEE: If you want to do the first one
15 first, 18 --
16 THE CHAIRMAN: Okay. We'll do number 18,
17 2008-565.
18 We'll open that public hearing.
19 First one is Tracey Arpen, followed by
20 Steve -- is it Powels?
21 AUDIENCE MEMBER: Yes, Powels.
22 (Audience member approaches the podium.)
23 THE CHAIRMAN: Mr. Arpen, Happy New Year
24 and welcome back.
25 MR. ARPEN: Thank you very much. It's a
Diane M.
Tropia,
7
1 pleasure to be here.
2 Tracey Arpen,
3
4 I'm here tonight on the sign waiver. I
5 appreciate you taking it up again. I was
6 delayed in traffic before, when you were taking
7 it up last time, and there was some confusion as
8 to whether or not we had reached an agreement.
9 We had not. We're very close, but I have
10 to tell you, the council, that there is one
11 point of contention that we can't agree on, and
12 that is controls on the brightness of the sign
13 because this is a sign waiver for an electronic
14 message sign in a -- surrounded by rural
15 residential zoning.
16 And I'd like to pass out some materials, if
17 I could.
18 And, as I said, the church had been very
19 cooperative. We reached agreement on four of
20 five conditions that I think make the -- have a
21 much more satisfactory situation than it would
22 be otherwise, but the problem is that --
23 As you can see from the photographs on the
24 second or third page, this is a very rural
25 area. It's one of the few pockets of rural
Diane M.
Tropia,
8
1 residential zoning left in Mandarin. As you can
2 see, it's not at all a built-up area, and it's,
3 in my view, just inappropriate for an electronic
4 changing message, particularly with no controls
5 on brightness. We've got some controls in terms
6 of how frequently it can change and so forth.
7 Now, the church has agreed to amber, but I
8 have observed and have been advised that amber
9 lights can be as bright as red lights. And so
10 in the absence of some controls on the
11 brightness of the sign, I cannot support it.
12 I feel that it's inappropriate for the
13 area. It's the type of signage you would see in
14 a commercial zoning district on a street such
15 as -- in our area, such as
17 And I think the real problem is that
18 there's nothing unique about this church parcel
19 to distinguish it from any other church in the
20 city of
21 probably have them in your districts, churches
22 that are in residential neighborhoods. They're
23 allowed to be there, but the point is they're
24 allowed to be there because churches generally
25 are compatible with the surrounding areas.
Diane M.
Tropia,
9
1 Their activities, their signage and so forth are
2 not intrusive.
3 And I think you can see some of the back of
4 that handout, some photographs of some of the
5 other churches in the area, all of which have a
6 manually changing electronic -- a manually
7 changing message sign, not an electronic sign.
8 And I think that just to allow that on a street
9 such as this is inappropriate, does not meet the
10 criteria for a sign waiver under the ordinance
11 code and should not be permitted.
12 And I'm be glad to answer any questions
13 that any of the committee members may have.
14 Thank you.
15 THE CHAIRMAN: Thank you, Mr. Arpen.
16 MR. ARPEN: And I know if the pastor
17 planned to do a vote, we do have a list of the
18 conditions we've agreed to. But, as I said, the
19 one that we have not agreed to, have been unable
20 to reach agreement on -- there is apparently a
21 mechanism to control the brightness, but we've
22 been unable to reach agreement as to whether or
23 not the church would do that.
24 Thank you.
25 THE CHAIRMAN: Hold on a second. We've got
Diane M. Tropia,
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1 a question from Mr. Joost.
2 MR. JOOST: I was just going to ask you to
3 submit the conditions so we can read them.
4 MR. ARPEN: I have a few more copies here
5 if it would be helpful.
6 MS. ELLER: Through the Chair to Tracey
7 Arpen, is it the list of conditions as amended
8 in the 11:16 a.m. e-mail?
9 MR. ARPEN: Through the Chair, no, I'm
10 sorry. It would be -- actually would be that
11 one with the exception of the underlined
12 language in number 5.
13 MS. ELLER: Okay. So --
14 MR. ARPEN: I'm sorry. Actually with
15 respect to number 5 in its entirety.
16 MS. ELLER: Okay. So the conditions that
17 are agreed upon are as follows:
18 "The sign, other than the electronic
19 message component, shall be externally
20 illuminated."
21 The second one is, "The LED component shall
22 display only static messages, which messages
23 shall change no more frequently than once every
24 three minutes."
25 Number 3, "The messages shall change and be
Diane M.
Tropia,
11
1 displayed without the use of scrolling,
2 rotating, zooming, flashing, or any other form
3 of animation."
4 Number 4, "The LED component shall use only
5 amber lights."
6 Number 5 was proposed and not agreed upon,
7 and it had to do with the level of brightness of
8 the sign.
9 And then number 6 in this list, which has
10 been agreed upon, is that, "The LED component
11 shall not be illuminated between the hours of
12 9:00 p.m. and 6:00 a.m."
13 THE CHAIRMAN: And was that the agreement?
14 MR. ARPEN: That is. Those are the five
15 items we reached agreement on. As I said, we
16 weren't able to reach agreement on the
17 brightness controls.
18 THE CHAIRMAN: Okay. Thank you.
19 Steve Powels.
20 (Audience member approaches the podium.)
21 THE CHAIRMAN: Sir, name and address for
22 the record and you've got three minutes.
23 AUDIENCE MEMBER: I am Steve Powels, pastor
24 of Mandarin Assembly of God,
25 And just working through the process here,
Diane M.
Tropia,
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1 I have my file here. We started this on
2 Valentine's Day, when I first initiated the
3 process 11 months ago. And we are 250 families
4 in Mandarin that beg to differ as far as our one
5 neighbor concerns as far as what would be
6 appropriate for that.
7 Loretto Road is a very busy road, has a lit
8 school sign, a lit convenience store sign, very
9 active road. But our church offers many, many
10 things to the community that -- that many of the
11 community want to know more about with family
12 and marriage issues and so forth.
13 So we proposed a very tasteful, well-placed
14 sign. We've been very gracious and agreed to
15 almost all except the one that sets a percentage
16 on, it has to be 75 percent at this time and
17 25 percent at this time. That's a little bit of
18 micromanaging. It's already amber lighting,
19 it's already going to be off at night. There's
20 really no reason to go any further than that.
21 It's going to be amber, it's going to be
22 nonintrusion. And so we just appreciate this
23 being passed with those five that we agreed upon
24 as part of it.
25 THE CHAIRMAN: Thank you, sir.
Diane M.
Tropia,
13
1 MR. POWELS: Yes, sir.
2 THE CHAIRMAN: Seeing no further speakers,
3 we'll close that public hearing. And I guess
4 before we hear the amendment, let's listen to
5 the district councilperson talk about this.
6 MR. WEBB: Thank you, Mr. Chairman, for
7 your patience in this matter.
8 And thank you to Pastor Powels and to
9 Tracey for working together on this. I
10 understand where Mr. Arpen is coming from in
11 this with respect to his opposition.
12 And, Tracey, I hear where you're coming
13 from and your protection of the community. A
14 couple of points to it, however, with respect to
16 neighbor. I think you know that. You know, as
17 the crow flies, I'm probably less than an eighth
18 of a mile away, so I'm very familiar with the
19 area.
20 The pastor is correct, there is an internal
21 illumination sign that is just down the road.
22 And that, you know, is a hiccup as a result of
23 some zoning issues that occurred over the years.
24 But, in any event, with respect to overall
25 opposition to the waiver based on failure to
Diane M.
Tropia,
14
1 agree to one condition, I don't deem that
2 appropriate. I think that -- I support the
3 waiver based on the conditions in the absence of
4 the mechanism to control the brightness. I
5 think that this is -- you know, in the spirit of
6 compromise, no one gets everything they want. I
7 think that both parties have worked together in
8 an effort -- worked really hard to get this
9 thing done, and I support the waiver with the
10 conditions with the exception of that one.
11 I will say as well with respect to -- I'm
12 looking at the stuff -- or the materials that
13 Mr. Arpen has provided to us. You know, this
14 internal -- this -- I guess this is not a
15 conventional internal illumination sign, but I
16 think what it's more reflective of is just a
17 change in technology. These type of signs are
18 out there now.
19 If you look at the Mandarin Lutheran
20 Church, the First Christian Church and the
21
22 old time internal illumination signs. I do not,
23 in my heart of hearts, having lived -- you know,
24 living in the area myself, I don't see that this
25 sign with the restrictions imposed is any more
Diane M.
Tropia,
15
1 intrusive than any of these traditional signs.
2 You know, this could be a
3 sign where I attend mass. And that's constantly
4 scrolling, and that would not -- that would
5 clearly not be appropriate.
6 So, having said that, I support the waiver
7 with the five conditions and I applaud and
8 appreciate the efforts of both Mr. Arpen and
9 Pastor Powels.
10 THE CHAIRMAN: Thank you, Mr. Holt.
11 Planning Department, do you have
12 anything --
13 MR. JOOST: Webb.
14 THE CHAIRMAN: I'm sorry. Mr. Webb.
15 Does the Planning Department have anything
16 else to add other than what Ms. Eller read
17 earlier?
18 MR. KELLY: I'd just like to add that this
19 is something, I guess, that's kind of been
20 negotiated originally. Our staff report was
21 written in the context of the entire sign having
22 internal illumination and there was debate with
23 regards to -- and the applicant was willing to
24 allow for external illumination of the overall
25 sign, but the changing message device, we feel,
Diane M.
Tropia,
16
1 is a reasonable request. It's very limited
2 illumination, internally illuminated.
3 We feel the conditions, as proposed, the
4 amber lighting and the hours of operation and
5 the setbacks within the district will -- and the
6 location on a collector roadway, we feel are
7 mitigating factors and that we are supportive.
8 There was a staff recommendation for
9 denial, but I just wanted to point out that that
10 was based on the original application with
11 regards to the overall sign being internally
12 illuminated and not the changing message device.
13 THE CHAIRMAN: Thank you, sir.
14 Seeing no further discussion --
15 MR. JOOST: Move to grant the waiver with
16 the agreed upon conditions.
17 MR. REDMAN: Second.
18 THE CHAIRMAN: It's been moved and
19 seconded.
20 I'm sorry. Let the record show that
21 Mr. Redman is here.
22 Welcome, sir. Happy New Year.
23 It's been moved and seconded to grant the
24 waiver with the agreed upon conditions.
25 Any further discussion on granting the
Diane M.
Tropia,
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1 waiver?
2 COMMITTEE MEMBERS: (No response.)
3 THE CHAIRMAN: All in favor signify by
4 saying aye.
5 COMMITTEE MEMBERS: Aye.
6 THE CHAIRMAN: Those opposed.
7 COMMITTEE MEMBERS: (No response.)
8 THE CHAIRMAN: By your action, you've
9 amended this to grant the waiver.
10 MR. WEBB: Move the bill to grant the
11 waiver as amended with the conditions.
12 MR. JOOST: Second.
13 THE CHAIRMAN: It's been moved and seconded
14 to grant the waiver, blah, blah, blah, blah,
15 blah.
16 Open the ballot.
17 (Committee ballot opened.)
18 MR. GRAHAM: (Votes yea.)
19 MR. JOOST: (Votes yea.)
20 MR. BROWN: (Votes yea.)
21 MR. REDMAN: (Votes yea.)
22 MR. WEBB: (Votes yea.)
23 THE CHAIRMAN: Close the ballot and record
24 the vote.
25 (Committee ballot closed.)
Diane M.
Tropia,
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1 MS. LAHMEUR: Five yeas, zero nays.
2 THE CHAIRMAN: By your action, you have
3 approved to grant the waiver with conditions.
4 Okay. We are on to -784. We'll open the
5 public hearing.
6 Seeing no speakers, we'll continue that
7 public hearing and take no further action.
8 -799, we will open that public hearing.
9 And, Ms. Lee, did you want to speak before
10 we brought the speaker up?
11 MS. LEE: No.
12 THE CHAIRMAN: All right. Valarie Sawyer.
13 (Audience member approaches the podium.)
14 THE CHAIRMAN: Ma'am, I need your name and
15 address for the record, and you have three
16 minutes.
17 AUDIENCE MEMBER: Good afternoon.
18 Valarie Sawyer,
20 property since the 1970s. It was vacant land
21 and then a home was placed on the land.
22 The diagram that I'm passing out shows that
23 all the properties from the corner of Ribault
24 Avenue to Lem Turner are commercial properties.
25 The property from
Diane M.
Tropia,
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2 vacant land.
4 a commercial cellular tower which operates
5 T-Mobile, Verizon, and Sprint communication
6 centers.
7 Directly behind the house is a commercial
8 property, which is Vision Irrigation. Half a
9 block down the road there's a grocery store and
10 also an upholstery store. To the left of the
11 property there's approximately two acres of
12 commercial property which is vacant land.
13
14 organization whose mission is to provide quality
15 care, support services, and educational needs to
16 the elderly, veterans, and disabled within the
17 city of
18 Being a registered nurse for 14 years of
19 experience and also a certified health care
20 administrator, I have recognized a tremendous
21 need within the community concerning housing for
22 the elderly citizens with health care needs.
23 Many elderly require additional aid with
24 medicine administration, specialty diet,
25 dressing and bathing and other requirements for
Diane M.
Tropia,
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1 everyday living.
2 Nursing homes and specialty hospitals are
3 options which are costly and at times very
4 difficult to reside in due to bed availability
5 and capacity issues.
6
7 education for the community as I plan to work in
8 conjunction with FCCJ,
9 Educational Systems to provide education to the
10 elderly.
11 Also Life Care will also be receiving
12 services from religious organizations such as
13 churches to provide additional services to the
14 residents.
15 jobs within the community.
16 However, I do recognize that there has been
17 a strong opposition within the community in
18 reference to an assisted living facility in the
19 neighborhood. I have attended three community
20 meetings just to -- along with Planning and
21 Zoning. I have also been working diligently
22 with the Planning and Zoning Department to
23 ensure a safe environment within the property
24 limits of
25 who live within the community.
Diane M.
Tropia,
21
1
2 to
3 assistance to senior citizens in the
4
5 the above address will be a much needed
6 commodity for the city of
7 Thank you.
8 THE CHAIRMAN: Thank you, ma'am.
9 Seeing no further speakers, we will close
10 that public hearing.
11 Ms. Lee.
12 MS. LEE: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
13 I'm here today to listen and speak on this
14 particular rezoning. There was something the
15 speaker said, though, that was not known to me,
16 and I want to make sure that some of the
17 statements she made, hopefully they're
18 inaccurate.
19 But I've held three community meetings
20 to -- to the committee and the chairman, to
21 address this rezoning which is supposed to be an
22 assisted living facility. I did not hear
23 Ms. Sawyer even talk about that in detail as it
24 was discussed in the community meetings.
25 The Planning Department, with Mr. Crofts,
Diane M.
Tropia,
22
1 who I would just like to say has -- did an
2 outstanding job, number one, in taking the time
3 to come out three times, but not only that,
4 working on some revisions and recommendations
5 that the community had relative to putting an
6 assisted living facility there.
7 With it being changed from a PUD to a PUD,
8 it would still have allowed various usages which
9 would be somewhat detrimental, the community
10 felt, to that anything could go up. So the
11 revisions dealt with excluding all of those
12 usages that would nominally be listed, and it
13 was reduced to only an assisted living facility
14 and a single-family dwelling.
15 The community is somewhat split. At the
16 first community meeting there were many people
17 there who were there for information really.
18 They did not know exactly what was going on.
19 And so, therefore, their -- many of their
20 questions and opposition was due to the fact
21 that they were not knowledgeable of the issue.
22 At the second community meeting, there were
23 other people there, newer people and other
24 people who -- I went around the room to inquire
25 as to who would be opposed and who would be for
Diane M.
Tropia,
23
1 it, and it was somewhat split.
2 Many of the residents said that if the
3 revisions would take place, which Mr. Crofts
4 went back and drafted, then they would most
5 likely support it because they felt that it
6 would exclude those things that would open up a
7 door for other kind of usages to come in.
8 Then the other side was still adamantly
9 opposed. The spokesperson for the community was
10 Ms. Ellis, who I'm sure you've probably gotten
11 some communication from, who has spoken before,
12 along with some of the other residents. There
13 were also about four to five or six people who
14 were undecided.
15 The last community meeting was held last
16 night to review the changes that Mr. Crofts had
17 made and to once again try to get opposed.
18 Number one, my major concern was that the
19 community be given all of the information needed
20 so that they could make a decision. I felt that
21 we exhausted that process. And I wanted to see
22 if the community felt comfortable to move on
23 with this issue and, therefore, I would not
24 request another deferral.
25 That happened. They felt that it had been
Diane M.
Tropia,
24
1 exhausted, and I explained to them that if the
2 committee voted it up or if the committee voted
3 it down, that it would still be passed on to the
4 full council. And, of course, there would be no
5 deferral.
6 Now, my position in this matter is still
7 somewhat undecided, and there are a couple of
8 things that -- questions were raised which I
9 felt were very legitimate relative to the
10 traffic. As you know, Soutel and Ribault Avenue
11 has literally become a -- well,
12 has become a major thoroughfare. There are
13 several new subdivisions that have come up, and
14 therefore many -- well, maybe not many, but some
15 of the neighbors were concerned about their
16 property value as well as the traffic and the
17 security. I'm not --
18 You know, the issue of property value
19 usually comes up when we deal with these
20 matters. And because we don't have any
21 supporting documents to even respond to the
22 residents as to how will it affect my property
23 value, that is something that we just did not
24 get into, but the traffic I do think is an
25 issue, and not just because of this zoning.
Diane M.
Tropia,
25
1 So Mr. Crofts did come back, and I don't
2 know if you all have it in your folders, he did
3 come back and receive some information from the
4 traffic engineer -- or the person in that area
5 who stated that they did not feel that the
6 traffic count that they were using warranted a
7 traffic signal at that particular location. I
8 tend to disagree with that and I certainly can't
9 speak for the Planning Department.
10 So there are still some concerns about
11 that, I guess simply because if it did become an
12 assisted living facility, there may be some
13 concerns.
14 Now, Ms. Sawyer never told me that this was
15 a nonprofit organization. This application was
16 filed by her. And unless I have read this
17 wrong --
18 Mr. Graham, may I ask Mr. Crofts a
19 question, please?
20 THE CHAIRMAN: Sure.
21 Mr. Crofts.
22 MS. LEE: The application that was filed,
23 was it filed as an nonprofit organization, or
24 was it filed in the name of Valarie Sawyer?
25 MR. CROFTS: Through the Chair to Ms. Lee,
Diane M.
Tropia,
26
1 the application was filed under Valarie Sawyer,
2 and the applicant's company name on the
3 application was Life Care with an address given
4 of
5
6 MS. LEE: Okay. John, do you ever recall
7 any conversation of an nonprofit organization
8 heading this up?
9 MR. CROFTS: To my best recollection,
10 Ms. Lee, through the Chair, I do not.
11 MS. LEE: Okay. Is it -- am I to
12 understand that a nonprofit organization would
13 probably be one that would not assess a fee on a
14 person, or they could assess a fee?
15 THE CHAIRMAN: I don't think I understand
16 the question. A fee for what?
17 MS. LEE: Let me try it again.
18 This assisted living facility as detailed
19 by Ms. Sawyer at one of the meetings would be
20 charging a fee, whether it be through Medicaid
21 or private, I would assume. And usually
22 nonprofit organizations don't collect money, do
23 they?
24 THE CHAIRMAN: YMCA is a nonprofit. It
25 collects money.
Diane M.
Tropia,
27
1 MS. LEE: Okay.
2 MR. JOOST: I was going to say, a lot of
3 hospitals are nonprofit and they --
4 MS. LEE: Well, that is true. That is
5 true. I guess I'm thinking about -- well, let
6 me try it again.
7 If that is the case, then I have a question
8 of Ms. Sawyer.
9 THE CHAIRMAN: Ms. Sawyer, if we can get
10 you to come down here, please.
11 (Ms. Sawyer approaches the podium.)
12 MS. LEE: Would it be necessary -- wouldn't
13 the language dictate that if a person was
14 applying for something that they should state
15 exactly what the organization is?
16 THE CHAIRMAN: That's a good question. I
17 think you make a very valid point. Because if
18 it's a nonprofit that owns it, then we're
19 talking about taking it off the tax rolls where,
20 you know, that may also take into -- come into
21 consideration when you're looking at, you know,
22 this process.
23 MS. LEE: Right.
24 Through the Chair, Ms. Sawyer, good
25 afternoon.
Diane M.
Tropia,
28
1 You never mentioned that this was a
2 nonprofit organization in neither one of -- in
3 either one of the meetings.
4 MS. SAWYER: I didn't know that I had to
5 mention that it was a nonprofit organization. I
6 had said assisted living facility. I didn't
7 know that I had to mention --
8 MS. LEE: Well, Ms. Sawyer, why did you
9 mention it today?
10 And we had three meetings and the people
11 asked some very detailed questions, and I did
12 too. And I think I've been very lenient in
13 trying to be fair across the board not only to
14 the people that I represent but to you as the
15 applicant as well.
16 MS. SAWYER: Correct.
17 MS. LEE: And not one time did you mention
18 that this was a nonprofit organization.
19 MS. SAWYER: I may just -- I don't really
20 know why you're saying that, you know, I should
21 have mentioned it, I should have mentioned it.
22 There's nothing that I was trying to close or
23 anything that I was doing to not let you
24 recognize that it was a nonprofit organization.
25 I didn't know that I had to bring that up at the
Diane M.
Tropia,
29
1 community meeting.
2 MS. LEE: Well, now, Ms. Sawyer, in all
3 fairness, you -- this community has been
4 intensely opposed to this. And in an effort to
5 even help you as an applicant, I'm a little
6 disturbed that you would say that you didn't
7 know that you needed to say this, that you don't
8 understand why I'm asking this. I don't
9 understand that.
10 MS. SAWYER: Being a nonprofit
11 organization, in what way would that -- as far
12 as what the community was, the issues they were
13 bringing up, there was no time that we were
14 discussing things that I -- that there was even
15 a question brought up as far as whether or not
16 my facility was profit or nonprofit.
17 THE CHAIRMAN: Ms. Sawyer, I'm a little
18 disturbed. Number one, they asked you some very
19 detailed questions as to the cost, how many
20 people you would have there.
21 MS. SAWYER: Correct.
22 MS. LEE: They asked you all kind of
23 detailed information. And the impression given,
24 Ms. Sawyer, was that this facility would be run
25 by you as an individual as the owner.
Diane M.
Tropia,
30
1 MS. SAWYER: Right.
2 MS. LEE: That's the difference.
3 You never said to the group that it was an
4 organization that would be running it. That is
5 a clear difference.
6 MS. SAWYER: But I am the owner. I am the
7 one who will be still running the organization.
8 I am the owner of the facility.
9 MS. LEE: But a nonprofit organization
10 includes other folks; am I correct?
11 MS. SAWYER: Right. There is also a vice
12 president, and then there is also a treasurer.
13 MS. LEE: See that -- I think I'm going to
14 have to defer this.
15 Let me -- through the Chair to Mr. Crofts,
16 or somebody from Planning, or Ms. Eller,
17 someone.
18 Is it a simple procedure when we do these
19 assisted living -- or whatever, does the
20 applicant have to disclose that there was a
21 nonprofit organization or should that be -- I
22 mean, would you not want the people to know
23 that? Because all of the questions -- let me --
24 I know I'm speaking as I ask the questions, so
25 help me out here.
Diane M.
Tropia,
31
1 The people in the community were very
2 concerned about this issue. They were -- you
3 know, some of them, no matter what you said or
4 did, were opposed to it. And their questions
5 were pointed directly to Ms. Sawyer, and many of
6 them said, well, the applicant seem to do this,
7 do that, and if she would be running it, or
8 whatever, or the owner.
9 You're not just the owner. This is a
10 nonprofit organization. And the impression that
11 has been given to the community is that the
12 owner is you. You are not the sole owner of
13 this facility.
14 MS. SAWYER: But I'm the only medical
15 person that is on the staff. I will be making
16 the majority of all the --
17 MS. LEE: Ms. Sawyer, stop. Excuse me. I
18 don't mean to be rude to you.
19 MS. SAWYER: Uh-huh.
20 MS. LEE: But you understand what I'm
21 saying?
22 MS. SAWYER: I do understand what you're
23 saying, Ms. Lee.
24 MS. LEE: Okay. You have put me in a
25 precarious position because the people in the
Diane M.
Tropia,
32
1 community were under the impression that you
2 were the owner, period.
3 I have no problem with a nonprofit
4 organization. But if that was the case, then
5 they should have been told that so that they
6 could ask the kind of questions that they were
7 concerned about. Number one, who's going to be
8 running it, who owns it.
9 That was -- that was a straight question,
10 who owns the facility, and you stated to the
11 people in the community that you were the
12 owner. Not once did you ever say that there
13 were other owners or that it was an
14 organization, Ms. Sawyer. And you know they did
15 ask you that.
16 So to some degree they have been misled and
17 it puts me in a position, as their
18 representative -- to allow this to move on
19 without informing them of that, I just could
20 not -- I don't feel good about that.
21 And so, again, my question to you, if they
22 ask you who was the owner, why didn't you state
23 at that time that you were a nonprofit
24 organization and that you were not the only
25 owner? Because you answered them in that you
Diane M.
Tropia,
33
1 were the owner.
2 MS. SAWYER: I cannot -- I cannot recall
3 anyone actually asking me who owns the
4 facility. Every time we were at a community
5 meeting, I was just introduced as the applicant,
6 not as -- no one actually said, do you own this
7 property, but I do not -- I do not feel as
8 though I misled the community in any way.
9 MS. LEE: Excuse me, Ms. Sawyer. That is
10 just not true. Let me refresh your memory, if I
11 can.
12 One of the questions asked was who was the
13 owner and how did you come across the property,
14 didn't you know certain things.
15 MS. SAWYER: Right.
16 MS. LEE: And you told them that you looked
17 on the Internet or something like that.
18 MS. SAWYER: Right.
19 MS. LEE: And you saw that the property was
20 commercial general, so you had no idea that it
21 was a PUD.
22 MS. SAWYER: Correct.
23 MS. LEE: Or that you had to do these
24 things.
25 MS. SAWYER: Uh-huh.
Diane M.
Tropia,
34
1 MS. LEE: That was a pointed question.
2 MS. SAWYER: Right.
3 MS. LEE: And you stated to them that you
4 owned the property, that it was yours, and that
5 you would be running the facility.
6 MS. SAWYER: Okay. Well, you're correct
7 as -- you're correct, as I should have mentioned
8 then that I was -- it was a nonprofit
9 organization.
10 It did not come across my mind to mention
11 it at that point. I didn't know that it would
12 be a major issue, that it was a nonprofit
13 organization. I did not think that it would be
14 anything of major concern or -- because I am
15 basically running this organization by myself.
16 The other people that are in the business with
17 me or in the organization is my husband, and he
18 has a nonmedical background at all.
19 MS. LEE: Ms. Sawyer, you did not provide
20 all the information. There were questions asked
21 as late as last night. Your husband, who was
22 there for the first time, never even mentioned
23 that he was part of this organization.
24 And to mislead, when pointed questions were
25 asked of you, to me, is just not the way you
Diane M. Tropia,
35
1 do. It is misleading, it is their neighborhood,
2 and I think that I have been very fair to you.
3 MS. SAWYER: Yes, you have.
4 MS. LEE: I was accused of supporting you.
5 I never saw you, I never knew you. The people
6 hammered me about even -- with the thought
7 process that for some reason there was some
8 political connection or some kind of connection
9 between myself and the applicant.
10 Am I correct --
11 MS. SAWYER: Yes.
12 MS. LEE: -- Mr. Crofts?
13 And I had to straighten that out. And now
14 here we're here today, and I'm now finding out
15 that it's a nonprofit organization when the
16 people were allowed to ask all of the questions,
17 that they have left this meeting thinking that
18 Ms. Sawyer -- even those opposed -- is the owner
19 and full operator, that no one else is the
20 owner. So if something happens --
21 The people are concerned. You know, there
22 are other folks involved, you know. You know,
23 and I just don't -- I'm not -- you know, and the
24 other thing Ms. Sawyer mentioned, that it would
25 provide jobs within the community. That was
Diane M.
Tropia,
36
1 never stated. She did state that there would be
2 people -- they were asked who would be there
3 with the residents. Ms. Sawyer explained that
4 in an assisted living facility, she would hire
5 people, that she would not be there overnight,
6 but there would be people there overnight.
7 These were very detailed, technical
8 questions asked by the residents.
9 MS. SAWYER: And a caregiver at night is a
10 job. And I had also stated that there would be
11 a cook there during the daytime. There was
12 parking that was allotted for employees.
13 MS. LEE: No, ma'am.
14 MS. SAWYER: I didn't think that --
15 MS. LEE: No, ma'am. No, excuse me. I was
16 going by the comments that you made when you
17 came before the podium this evening.
18 MS. SAWYER: Correct, uh-huh.
19 MS. LEE: There were three things that I
20 wrote that you said. Number one, nonprofit
21 organization that you didn't mention. Number
22 two, providing jobs within the community.
23 MS. SAWYER: Right.
24 MS. LEE: And number three, you talked
25 about all of the commercial property around it,
Diane M.
Tropia,
37
1 but you never talked about that there were
2 residents that were in front of this property.
3 And I just think, Ms. Sawyer -- I guess my
4 disappointment is you have come before the
5 committee -- if I were not here, this committee
6 would vote on this issue, probably with the
7 assumption that, as the councilperson, I had no
8 problems with it, which I was leaning towards
9 supporting it simply because of the fact of all
10 of the work that had been done to revise it and
11 just break it down.
12 But now it's a nonprofit organization, not
13 owned by -- just owned by this. People are
14 going to be concerned. I'm going to ask that
15 this be deferred to give me an opportunity to
16 get back with the spokesperson in the community
17 to let them do whatever it is they do.
18 Now, through the Chair to Mr. Crofts.
19 John, I'm just going to ask you, and I don't
20 want -- if I'm putting you in an improper
21 position, tell me if you feel that the position
22 that I have taken or I am suggesting to take is
23 the appropriate position.
24 You were to every meeting, and I'm looking
25 for some --
Diane M.
Tropia,
38
1 MR. CROFTS: I will -- through the Chair, I
2 will just say that, if there has not been a full
3 disclosure of information, that's a pretty
4 important point that needs to be transacted as
5 part of this particular process, if Ms. Lee
6 feels that that's important.
7 From a Planning standpoint, from our
8 professional planning perspective, it's not as
9 critical as I think it is as a trust and
10 relationship to the community. So I see value
11 in it from the Planning Department's standpoint,
12 even though it is not our immediate criteria for
13 the review of this particular rezoning.
14 MS. LEE: Thank you.
15 I think that, again, a nonprofit is a
16 nonprofit. As we all know, they're all
17 throughout the city. I mean, we approve them.
18 We give them money to do things just through
19 here.
20 But, again, the issue is one of trust, and
21 it certainly is of integrity with me. You know,
22 whether I'm for or against it, I left there
23 thinking that everything had been exhausted,
24 that I had allowed the applicant ample
25 opportunity. I'm talking about -- went out of
Diane M.
Tropia,
39
1 the way to give the applicant an opportunity to
2 go back and revisit this matter because there
3 were people who stated they have elderly people
4 in their families.
5 We need assisted living facilities, we need
6 nursing homes. My mother is in an assisted
7 living facility. I disclosed that. And the
8 reason I disclosed it is because, as the
9 conversation was going on and the people were
10 asking detailed questions, I had already been
11 accused of knowing Ms. Sawyer, which I didn't.
12 But from an integrity standpoint, how could
13 I, as the representative, dealing with an issue
14 like this, sit back and act -- ignore like I
15 didn't know anything about assisted living
16 facilities, so I disclosed about my own mother.
17 I think that's just an issue of integrity.
18 And I cannot see this going through at this
19 particular time, at least until I have gone
20 back -- and I know I'm being repetitive, but I'm
21 a little aggravated by this -- going back and at
22 least letting Ms. Ellis know that it is a
23 nonprofit organization.
24 It is only three people in it. So the
25 issue isn't as though there are 20 or 15 people
Diane M.
Tropia,
40
1 running this. It's just an issue when they
2 asked Ms. Sawyer straight outright questions,
3 there are three things she never mentioned,
4 jobs, nonprofit, and a couple of other things,
5 and I just --
6 Ms. Sawyer, at this particular time -- and
7 of course it's up to the chairman of the
8 committee. And I would suggest strongly to you
9 that you get back in touch with Ms. Ellis
10 yourself and that you share with her some things
11 that you shared with the committee today that
12 you never talked about in any of those three
13 community meetings.
14 MS. SAWYER: And I will do that, get back
15 with Ms. Ellis.
16 But one thing that you did say that I never
17 mentioned when I was addressing the committee
18 was that there was problems in the community. I
19 did say that there had been some opposition and
20 the people --
21 MS. LEE: No, I didn't say that. You
22 didn't mention about residential properties is
23 what I said.
24 MS. SAWYER: Okay.
25 MS. LEE: No. No, you mentioned that there
Diane M.
Tropia,
41
1 was opposition. No, I said that there were
2 residential. Ms. Ellis lives right across the
3 street, and there were other folks. So the
4 impression that you gave the committee,
5 everything around there was commercial.
6 MS. SAWYER: Right. But I also passed out
7 a diagram that they actually had --
8 MS. LEE: Okay.
9 MS. SAWYER: -- that showed them the
10 commercial property versus the residential
11 property.
12 MS. LEE: Right.
13 MS. SAWYER: And in no way I -- I apologize
14 if you feel as though I offended you. But in no
15 way did I intend to offend you, and in no way
16 did I try to disclose any information from you
17 or the board or anybody in the community.
18 MS. LEE: Well, I'm not offended. I'm just
19 disappointed because we did everything we could
20 to be fair. Mr. Crofts went out of his way --
21 MS. SAWYER: Yes, they did. Yes, you did
22 and, yes, the Planning and Zoning Department
23 did.
24 MS. LEE: And to come here today and do
25 something different, it's disappointing. Not
Diane M.
Tropia,
42
1 offended. That goes with this job.
2 But Mr. -- I'm somewhat being repetitive
3 now.
4 Mr. Graham, if we could defer this until
5 this matter can be cleared up. If Ms. Ellis
6 knows, once this is disclosed to them, and they
7 don't have a problem with it, then it can be
8 taken up at the City Council meeting if you,
9 Mr. Chairman, would agree to take it out.
10 If the community wants to meet back with
11 Ms. Sawyer and they have other questions -- and
12 I think that they should be allowed to do that.
13 THE CHAIRMAN: Ms. Lee, I don't have a
14 problem with deferring this. As far as I can
15 tell, I don't think any committee members have a
16 problem with deferring this.
17 I guess the question I have with the
18 applicant, if you have any problems deferring
19 this. Now, normally we take the lead of the
20 district councilperson. So, I mean, I guess --
21 MS. SAWYER: I'll do whatever Ms. Lee
22 decides is best to do.
23 THE CHAIRMAN: You're a wise woman.
24 That all being said, I guess we will reopen
25 the public hearing and we will defer this and
Diane M.
Tropia,
43
1 take no further action.
2 MS. LEE: Mr. Chairman, I wish you felt
3 that way about all my rezonings.
4 THE CHAIRMAN: Ms. Lee, did you have
5 anything else?
6 MS. LEE: Yeah. Mr. Chairman, I would like
7 to go on record on item 16. I missed that one,
8 on page 6.
9 I did receive a letter from Paul Harden who
10 is representing this property. And I have not
11 had an opportunity to talk with him on this
12 matter, and I will do that in the month of
13 January.
14 THE CHAIRMAN: Okay. Thank you very much.
15 MS. LEE: And thank you for -- committee
16 members, for being patient.
17 THE CHAIRMAN: Okay. Bottom of page 7,
18 2008-840, we'll open that public hearing.
19 Seeing no speakers, we'll continue that
20 public hearing and take no further action.
21 Top of page 8. 2008-854. We'll open that
22 public hearing.
23 Seeing no speakers, we'll close that public
24 hearing.
25 MR. HARDEN: I didn't move quick enough.
Diane M.
Tropia,
44
1 I'm sorry.
2 MR. JOOST: Which one?
3 MR. HARDEN: 22.
4 THE CHAIRMAN: Yeah. -854?
5 MR. HARDEN: Yes.
6 THE CHAIRMAN: Did you not fill out a
7 speaker's card, Mr. Harden?
8 MR. HARDEN: I did not. I'm sorry. I was
9 reading.
10 THE CHAIRMAN: We'll let you fill one out
11 when you're done.
12 MR. HARDEN: I'll fill one out immediately,
13 yes, sir.
14 Paul Harden,
15 This is a sign waiver on a site at Hodges
16 Boulevard. The Planning Department has
17 recommended approval with two conditions. We
18 are agreeable -- I think -- Mr. Kelly is there.
19 We've agreed to amend the first condition
20 so that there are up to ten available signs on
21 buildings B, C, and D, still not taking up more
22 than 10 percent of the wall space.
23 And with that amended condition, we are
24 agreeable to the Planning Department's
25 conditions.
Diane M.
Tropia,
45
1 THE CHAIRMAN: Any questions of the
2 applicant?
3 COMMITTEE MEMBERS: (No response.)
4 THE CHAIRMAN: Seeing none, we will reclose
5 the public hearing.
6 MR. HARDEN: Thank you.
7 I'll fill out a card.
8 THE CHAIRMAN: Is there anything to be
9 added by the Planning Department?
10 MR. KELLY: No.
11 We're okay with the additional three wall
12 signs, given the limitation with the occupancy
13 frontage being 10 percent, and that the font
14 size and the lettering, these are all basically
15 carved into the wall and externally illuminated,
16 so we don't have an issue with that.
17 THE CHAIRMAN: Okay. That all being said,
18 can I get an amendment?
19 MR. WEBB: Move the amendment to grant the
20 waiver with conditions.
21 MR. JOOST: Second.
22 THE CHAIRMAN: It's been moved and seconded
23 to grant the waiver with conditions.
24 Any further discussion on the amendment?
25 MR. HARDEN: Conditioned as amended?
Diane M.
Tropia,
46
1 MS. ELLER: (Inaudible.)
2 MR. HARDEN: Well, that --
3 THE CHAIRMAN: Come to the mic, sir.
4 MR. HARDEN: I'm sorry.
5 The conditions are amended. There's a
6 change from a 10 to a 7 -- a 7 to a 10 in the
7 first one. I just want to make sure that the
8 condition is amended.
9 THE CHAIRMAN: We got that?
10 MS. ELLER: Yes.
11 MR. HARDEN: Thank you.
12 THE CHAIRMAN: We're good.
13 All in favor of the amendment signify by
14 saying aye.
15 COMMITTEE MEMBERS: Aye.
16 THE CHAIRMAN: Those opposed.
17 THE CHAIRMAN: By your action, you've
18 approved the amendment.
19 MR. WEBB: Move to grant the waiver.
20 MR. JOOST: Second.
21 THE CHAIRMAN: It's been moved and seconded
22 to grant the waiver.
23 Any further discussion on the bill?
24 COMMITTEE MEMBERS: (No response.)
25 THE CHAIRMAN: Seeing none, please open the
Diane M.
Tropia,
47
1 ballot.
2 (Committee ballot opened.)
3 MR. GRAHAM: (Votes yea.)
4 MR. JOOST: (Votes yea.)
5 MR. BROWN: (Votes yea.)
6 MR. REDMAN: (Votes yea.)
7 MR. WEBB: (Votes yea.)
8 THE CHAIRMAN: Close the ballot and record
9 the vote.
10 (Committee ballot closed.)
11 MS. LAHMEUR: Five yeas, zero nays.
12 THE CHAIRMAN: By your action, you have
13 approved 2008-854 to -- you have approved -854
14 to grant the waiver with conditions.
15 -880 is deferred, as we said.
16 -890 and -891, we will open the public
17 hearing for both of those.
18 Seeing no speakers, we'll close the public
19 hearing for both of those.
20 MR. WEBB: Move to withdraw.
21 MR. JOOST: Second.
22 THE CHAIRMAN: It's been moved and seconded
23 to withdraw -890.
24 Any discussion on the withdrawal?
25 COMMITTEE MEMBERS: (No response.)
Diane M.
Tropia,
48
1 THE CHAIRMAN: Seeing none, please open the
2 ballot.
3 (Committee ballot opened.)
4 MR. GRAHAM: (Votes yea.)
5 MR. JOOST: (Votes yea.)
6 MR. BROWN: (Votes yea.)
7 MR. REDMAN: (Votes yea.)
8 MR. WEBB: (Votes yea.)
9 THE CHAIRMAN: Close the ballot and record
10 the vote.
11 (Committee ballot closed.)
12 MS. LAHMEUR: Five yeas, zero nays.
13 THE CHAIRMAN: By your action, you have
14 withdrawn -890.
15 MR. WEBB: Move to withdraw -891.
16 MR. JOOST: Second.
17 THE CHAIRMAN: It's been moved and seconded
18 to withdraw -891.
19 Any discussion on -891?
20 COMMITTEE MEMBERS: (No response.)
21 THE CHAIRMAN: Seeing none, please open the
22 ballot.
23 (Committee ballot opened.)
24 MR. GRAHAM: (Votes yea.)
25 MR. JOOST: (Votes yea.)
Diane M.
Tropia,
49
1 MR. BROWN: (Votes yea.)
2 MR. REDMAN: (Votes yea.)
3 MR. WEBB: (Votes yea.)
4 THE CHAIRMAN: Close the ballot and record
5 the vote.
6 (Committee ballot closed.)
7 MS. LAHMEUR: Five yeas, zero nays.
8 THE CHAIRMAN: By your action, you have
9 withdrawn -891.
10 -893, we will open the public hearing.
11 We are deferring it, but we still have a
12 public hearing for this bill.
13 MR. WEBB: (Inaudible.)
14 THE CHAIRMAN: Okay. I have three cards
15 that are here that are speaking in opposition,
16 and then I know the attorney for the Mayport
17 Village wanted to speak.
18 If you can come on down, Mr. Anderson, or
19 whoever is speaking.
20 (Audience member approaches the podium.)
21 THE CHAIRMAN: Now, I granted this guy some
22 extra time to speak so he can speak for the
23
24 I also have an extra card here for
25 Ms. Goller. Do you want to speak as well?
Diane M.
Tropia,
50
1 MS. GOLLER: Yes.
2 THE CHAIRMAN: And Alyce Decker.
3 AUDIENCE MEMBER: Second.
4 THE CHAIRMAN: And Andrew Miller.
5 AUDIENCE MEMBER: That's me.
6 THE CHAIRMAN: You're Andrew Miller. Okay.
7 All right. Sir, I told you I'd give you
8 guys up to about ten minutes. I know we have
9 heard a lot of this testimony already, but this
10 is new testimony because we're hearing some
11 feedback on the actual settlement agreement that
12 was given to you guys.
13 So, sir, we will start the clock, and name
14 and address for the record.
15 AUDIENCE MEMBER: My name is Andrew Miller,
17 Thank you, Councilman Graham. I'll
18 probably only take about 45 seconds.
19 I'm the executive director and legal
20 counsel for the Public Trust Environmental Legal
21
22
23 with the offices located at 2029 North 3rd
24 Street in
25 The Public Trust has the authority to
Diane M.
Tropia,
51
1 represent the Mayport Civic Association, Dean
2 and Tabitha Singleton, and John and Sandra
3 Tuttle.
4 Our clients would be aggrieved and
5 adversely affected by the passage of ordinance
6 2008-893 to a greater extent than the community
7 at large. So on behalf of our clients, as the
8 executive director and legal counsel for the
9 Public Trust, I would ask to enter in this
10 document into the record.
11 And I appreciate the council's action on
12 deferring this ordinance tonight.
13 THE CHAIRMAN: Thank you, sir.
14 Alyce Decker.
15 (Audience member approaches the podium.)
16 THE CHAIRMAN: Hold on a second,
17 Ms. Decker.
18 Mr. Miller, could you come back, please.
19 MR. MILLER: (Complies.)
20 THE CHAIRMAN: Mr. Joost.
21 MR. JOOST: I'm sorry. I didn't catch
22 the -- thank you for coming down. I didn't
23 catch the last part of your comments.
24 Realistically, at this point, do you think
25 we'll be able to come -- when I say "we," you
Diane M.
Tropia,
52
1 and the Port Authority come to some sort of
2 compromise?
3 MR. MILLER: Well, we certainly hope so.
4 As you might know, our negotiations have
5 come to an impasse, so we've stopped for now,
6 but we are certainly open to meeting with
7 JaxPort as many times as possible to come to an
8 agreement.
9 MR. JOOST: Okay. What --
10 MR. MILLER: If you want a percentage -- if
11 you want a percentage, I don't know. It all
12 depends on what we can agree to.
13 MR. JOOST: What is the main disagreement
14 right now at this point?
15 MR. MILLER: Well, there are several
16 disagreements. I don't feel comfortable
17 discussing all the --
18 MR. JOOST: That's fine. I understand.
19 MR. MILLER: But things -- things that
20 we've talked about since the beginning. They
21 include shore power and the viability of the
22 shrimping and fishing industry.
23 MR. JOOST: All right. Thank you. I hope
24 you guys work it out.
25 THE CHAIRMAN: Hold on a second, sir.
Diane M.
Tropia,
53
1 Mr. Webb.
2 MR. WEBB: Thank you, sir.
3 What's your name again, please?
4 MR. MILLER: My name is Andrew Miller.
5 MR. WEBB: Mr. Miller, thank you for coming
6 down here tonight.
7 Who is it that you represent just to
8 clarify for the record?
9 MR. MILLER: There's Mayport Civic
10 Association, Dean and Tabitha Singleton, and
11 John and Sandra Tuttle.
12 MR. WEBB: So you represent all three of
13 those individuals and/or entities?
14 MR. MILLER: Yes, sir.
15 MR. WEBB: Okay. And who else is present
16 at these negotiations with the Port Authority?
17 You say you're engaged in some sort of
18 settlement negotiations or compromise
19 discussions with the Authority. Who else is
20 present at the -- who else is party to those
21 discussions?
22 MR. MILLER: JaxPort officials.
23 MR. WEBB: That's it?
24 MR. MILLER: Well, we've had a few other
25 people that aren't mentioned in the settlement
Diane M.
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1 agreement that were present for phone
2 conversations.
3 MR. WEBB: Okay. So who ultimately is
4 going to sign off on whatever agreement? Who's
5 got the authority to enter into some sort of
6 compromise? Because the way I see it now,
7 compromise is not going to occur because you've
8 got multiple parties all with divergent
9 interests. Is that accurate?
10 MR. MILLER: I don't think so.
11 I can speak for the Singletons and the
12 Tuttles and the Mayport Civic Association.
13 MR. WEBB: Uh-huh.
14 MR. MILLER: And all of them have the same
15 issues. So if one of them were to agree to the
16 settlement agreement, I do not see why the other
17 two wouldn't.
18 At the beginning we talked with many
19 different parties. They have since dropped out
20 of settlement negotiations simply because they
21 weren't part of the original lawsuit and they
22 didn't want to be involved in anything if they
23 did not have to be.
24 MR. WEBB: Fair enough. Thank you.
25 THE CHAIRMAN: Thank you, sir.
Diane M.
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1 Ms. Decker.
2 (Audience member approaches the podium.)
3 THE CHAIRMAN: Sorry about that.
4 Name and address for the record, please.
5 AUDIENCE MEMBER: Yes. My name is Alyce
6 Decker, and I live at
7 Ponte Vedra.
8 I've been a member of the Mayport
9 Waterfront Partnership for the past nine years.
10 I understand that you're not moving on this
11 tonight, but I think it's important that a voice
12 be held -- or be heard for Mayport at each
13 public hearing.
14 The main item that I wanted to address
15 tonight is that -- I think that I have heard --
16 I know that I have heard in -- read in the press
17 and heard on the news that the residents of
18 Mayport have been portrayed as some that are
19 against development. And, in my opinion,
20 nothing could be further from the truth.
21 As a practicing and registered urban
22 planner, this is a community that has been
23 involved with the preparation of their community
24 for economic development. The development of a
25 stop station for the Jacksonville Sheriff's
Diane M.
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1 Office several years ago that was housed in
2 Mayport, the support of Sheriff Glover when he
3 walked the streets and personally put the
4 successful cleaning up of Mayport on his agenda.
5 Residents living with months of upheaval
6 from the construction of new sewers, sidewalks,
7 lighting, all of which a community needs to
8 attract investment and development.
9 Comprehensive plans and zoning updates
10 written and crafted to attract development and
11 protect the size and scale of their community
12 based on current best practices for waterfront
13 communities around the country has been
14 undertaken.
15 Meetings with the City were held, and City
16 staff worked tirelessly to craft the future for
17 this once thriving community. A meeting was
18 held with former City Councilwoman Elaine Brown
19 when she was provided with research on
20 comparable working waterfront communities and
21 the successful commercial boardwalks developed
22 as economic generators which was part of and
23 remains part of the future and hopeful future
24 for Mayport.
25 These are not the actions of a people
Diane M.
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1 opposed to economic development. And Mayport is
2 not working against the existence and missions
3 of JaxPort. Rather, they are working for their
4 community, just as any citizen of
5 whether they live in Mandarin,
6 Avondale, Ortega, Edgewood,
7 Northside, the Southside, Beauclerc, Baymeadows,
8 Five Points, or any other community in the city.
9 So I will leave the rest of our comments
10 for the public hearing before the City Council.
11 THE CHAIRMAN: Thank you.
12 MS. DECKER: And I beat my time.
13 Thank you.
14 THE CHAIRMAN: Thank you.
15 Ms. Goller.
16 (Ms. Goller approaches the podium.)
17 MS. GOLLER: Thank you, Chairman.
18 My name is Leslie Goller, and I live at
19 2247 Smullian Trail South.
20 And although an attorney, I won't take my
21 full three minutes tonight.
22 I took this opportunity as provided. I
23 know you all are continuing the discussion on
24 this and the consideration of this to make sure
25 that I ask you two things to do before you
Diane M.
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58
1 finally decide on this issue.
2 One is to read Andrew Brigham's letter that
3 was sent to you. It's a December 8th letter,
4 including an attachment. And I ask you to read
5 it yourself, not your assistant giving you a
6 summary, but please read this letter. It's a
7 complete factual dissertation of what the issues
8 are on this, and you need to read it and look at
9 the appendix.
10 The other thing that I ask you is -- if you
11 haven't already been out to Mayport, I ask you
12 to physically go out to Mayport and look at the
13 area that we're talking about. It's very
14 important that you see it.
15 Less than a couple of weeks ago, I went out
16 there myself and I saw that within six feet of
17 the road that we're talking about, the access
18 road to get out to Mayport, the
19 is right there. Less than six feet.
20 We're talking about destroying a wetlands
21 in -- just to build the road that goes out there
22 because that road is going to have to be
23 widened.
24 But please do do those two things. That's
25 the homework that you need to do before you
Diane M.
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1 decide this, and I ask you to do that on behalf
2 of the city of
3 Thank you.
4 THE CHAIRMAN: Thank you, ma'am.
5 John Reyes.
6 (Audience member approaches the podium.)
7 AUDIENCE MEMBER: Hello and good evening.
8 John Reyes, Visit
9 Street.
10 We are here to put on the record the cruise
11 tourism economic impact for the committee. And
12 respect for time, there's been a lot of dialogue
13 and discussion, so we're here to answer any
14 questions on tourism.
15 Thank you for your consideration.
16 THE CHAIRMAN: Thank you, sir.
17 Hold on, Mr. Reyes.
18 Mr. Joost.
19 MR. JOOST: Thanks for coming down.
20 MR. REYES: Yes, sir.
21 MR. JOOST: Is there -- what is the latest
22 economic data on -- I know one of the things
23 that the port had been claiming is that all the
24 ships have been leaving the port at 110 or -20
25 percent capacity.
Diane M.
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1 With the latest economic downturn, to your
2 knowledge, has that changed at all?
3 MR. REYES: To our data and information, we
4 have not seen a decline in cruise ship tourism.
5 MR. JOOST: All right. Thank you.
6 THE CHAIRMAN: I have a question for you,
7 sir.
8 MR. REYES: Yes, sir.
9 THE CHAIRMAN: We've heard several of the
10 hotels and things come here and talk about the
11 economic impact that this would have as far as
12 the hotel industry.
13 MR. REYES: Uh-huh.
14 THE CHAIRMAN: If you had to guess, what do
15 you think the bed tax dollars would be generated
16 by this cruise ship terminal here in Mayport?
17 MR. REYES: Basically on the 40 percent pre
18 and post, you're looking at about 229 rooms. So
19 you're looking at an average rate of $80. So
20 it's about $18,000 per room night, with a total
21 economic impact on the bed tax is about $85,000
22 per night if we miss this opportunity.
23 THE CHAIRMAN: But, now, if we were -- at
24 the end of the day, if we were to add up the
25 total bed tax dollars that's generated that
Diane M.
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1 comes to the city through the TDC, how much are
2 we talking?
3 MR. REYES: Well, basically, again, on this
4 number, total bed tax is around 15 million. Per
5 night on the economic impact of this cruise ship
6 per year would be about 85,000. So close to
7 $85,000, sir.
8 THE CHAIRMAN: $85,000 a year?
9 MR. REYES: Yes.
10 THE CHAIRMAN: Okay.
11 MR. REYES: But we also look at the total
12 economic impact of what visitors spend as well,
13 restaurants, attractions, and et cetera.
14 THE CHAIRMAN: Well, no. I was just
15 looking for a specific number. It seemed like I
16 heard a number that was higher than that, but --
17 MR. JOOST: Tax dollars (inaudible)?
18 THE CHAIRMAN: Actually, tax dollars
19 collected is what I'm looking for.
20 MR. REYES: Correct.
21 Well, basically what we did is took the
22 40 percent number, 230 rooms, multiplied an
23 average rate of $80 gives you that number on
24 78 embarkations.
25 THE CHAIRMAN: Well, that's just -- and
Diane M.
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1 this is just assuming -- if things were to move
2 forward, you know, I'd like to see some of those
3 dollars actually channeled back to the Village
4 of Mayport, but we'll talk about that if this
5 thing actually gets passed.
6 MR. REYES: Absolutely. That's a
7 discussion that could happen at the Tourism
8 Development Council.
9 THE CHAIRMAN: Okay. Thank you.
10 MR. REYES: You're welcome.
11 THE CHAIRMAN: Seeing no further speakers,
12 we will close that public hearing and we'll
13 defer the bill.
14 Thank you very much.
15 -935, we will open the public hearing.
16 Mr. Kravitz.
17 (Mr. Kravitz approaches the podium.)
18 MR. KRAVITZ: Good evening.
19 I put on there for questions, but I think I
20 probably -- since there are some conditions, I
21 probably ought to just come up and acknowledge a
22 couple of things that -- on this rezoning, we do
23 have the support of the Planning Department, the
24 Planning Commission, the district councilman.
25 We're in full agreement with the Planning
Diane M.
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1 Department's conditions as outlined in the
2 report -- I think it was December the 11th.
3 THE CHAIRMAN: Thank you, sir.
4 Seeing no further speakers, we'll close
5 that public hearing and --
6 Guys, let's just hear the amendment.
7 MR. CROFTS: To the committee,
8 Mr. Chairman, the amendment consists of the
9 following conditions.
10 Number 1, "The development shall be subject
11 to the original legal description dated
12 September 25, 2008."
13 Number 2, "The development shall be subject
14 to the revised written description dated
15 November 14, 2008."
16 Number 3, "The development shall be subject
17 to the original site plan dated September 25,
18 2008."
19 Number 4 and finally, "The development
20 shall be subject to the review and approval of
21 the Development Services Division pursuant to
22 their memorandum dated October 20, 2008, or as
23 otherwise approved by the Planning and
24 Development Department."
25 Thank you.
Diane M.
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1 THE CHAIRMAN: Mr. Kravitz, is that as you
2 know it?
3 MR. KRAVITZ: Yes.
4 THE CHAIRMAN: Sounds great.
5 Do I --
6 MR. WEBB: Move to approve.
7 MR. JOOST: Second.
8 THE CHAIRMAN: It's been moved and seconded
9 for the amendment.
10 Any further discussion?
11 COMMITTEE MEMBERS: (No response.)
12 THE CHAIRMAN: Seeing none, all in favor
13 say aye.
14 COMMITTEE MEMBERS: Aye.
15 THE CHAIRMAN: Those opposed.
16 COMMITTEE MEMBERS: (No response.)
17 THE CHAIRMAN: By your action, you approved
18 the amendment.
19 MR. WEBB: Move the bill as amended.
20 MR. JOOST: Second.
21 THE CHAIRMAN: The bill has been moved and
22 seconded as amended.
23 Any further discussion on the bill?
24 COMMITTEE MEMBERS: (No response.)
25 THE CHAIRMAN: Seeing none, please open the
Diane M.
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1 ballot.
2 (Committee ballot opened.)
3 MR. GRAHAM: (Votes yea.)
4 MR. JOOST: (Votes yea.)
5 MR. BROWN: (Votes yea.)
6 MR. REDMAN: (Votes yea.)
7 MR. WEBB: (Votes yea.)
8 THE CHAIRMAN: Close the ballot and record
9 the vote.
10 (Committee ballot closed.)
11 MS. LAHMEUR: Five yeas, zero nays.
12 THE CHAIRMAN: By your action, you've
13 approved -935 as amended.
14 Thank you, Mr. Kravitz.
15 MR. KRAVITZ: Thank you.
16 THE CHAIRMAN: -936. We'll open the public
17 hearing.
18 Seeing no speakers, we'll continue that
19 public hearing and take no further action.
20 Top of page 10. -984. We'll open the
21 public hearing.
22 We have Mr. Wyman Duggan.
23 (Mr. Duggan approaches the podium.)
24 MR. DUGGAN: Wyman Duggan, 1301 Riverplace
25 Boulevard,
Diane M.
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1 I'm available for questions on the
2 substance of the bill.
3 There were two amendments to the conditions
4 at Planning Commission I'd like to ensure get
5 translated today.
6 Thank you.
7 THE CHAIRMAN: Thank you, Mr. Duggan.
8 Do you have the full support of your
9 district councilperson on this thing?
10 MR. DUGGAN: I believe that I do, sir.
11 THE CHAIRMAN: Okay. We'll close that
12 public hearing.
13 Let's hear the amendment.
14 MR. CROFTS: The amendments are as
15 follows:
16 Condition number 1, "The development shall
17 be subject to the original legal description
18 dated October 20, 2008."
19 Number 2, "The development shall be subject
20 to the original written description dated
21 October 20, 2008."
22 Number 3, "The development shall be subject
23 to the original site plan dated" -- and a
24 footnote -- "October 17, 2008."
25 Number 4, "The development shall be subject
Diane M.
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1 to the review and approval of the Development
2 Service Division or as otherwise approved by the
3 Florida Department of Transportation."
4 Fifth and finally, "On-site lighting
5 structures shall be limited to" -- and I note --
6 "30 feet in height with full cutoffs, shall be
7 designed and installed to localize illumination
8 onto the subject property and to minimize
9 unreasonable visual interference and impact onto
10 any adjoining properties."
11 That's it.
12 THE CHAIRMAN: Is that as you noted?
13 MR. DUGGAN: That's correct. Thank you.
14 THE CHAIRMAN: Okay.
15 MR. JOOST: Move the amendment.
16 MR. WEBB: Second.
17 THE CHAIRMAN: The amendment has been moved
18 and seconded.
19 Any further discussion on the amendment?
20 COMMITTEE MEMBERS: (No response.)
21 THE CHAIRMAN: Seeing none, all in favor
22 say aye.
23 COMMITTEE MEMBERS: Aye.
24 THE CHAIRMAN: Those opposed.
25 COMMITTEE MEMBERS: (No response.)
Diane M.
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1 THE CHAIRMAN: By your action, you've
2 approved the amendment.
3 MR. WEBB: Move the bill as amended.
4 MR. JOOST: Second.
5 THE CHAIRMAN: The bill has been moved and
6 seconded as amended.
7 Any further discussion on the bill?
8 COMMITTEE MEMBERS: (No response.)
9 THE CHAIRMAN: Seeing none, please open the
10 ballot.
11 (Committee ballot opened.)
12 MR. GRAHAM: (Votes yea.)
13 MR. JOOST: (Votes yea.)
14 MR. BROWN: (Votes yea.)
15 MR. REDMAN: (Votes yea.)
16 MR. WEBB: (Votes yea.)
17 THE CHAIRMAN: Close the ballot and record
18 the vote.
19 (Committee ballot closed.)
20 MS. LAHMEUR: Five yeas, zero nays.
21 THE CHAIRMAN: By your action, you've
22 approved -984.
23 Thank you, Mr. Duggan.
24 MR. DUGGAN: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
25 Mr. Chairman, I believe Mr. Reyes left some
Diane M.
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1 materials here for the record.
2 THE CHAIRMAN: Okay.
3 MR. DUGGAN: Thank you.
4 THE CHAIRMAN: Thanks.
5 -985, we'll open that public hearing.
6 Mr. Kravitz.
7 (Mr. Kravitz approaches the podium.)
8 MR. KRAVITZ: Yes. Dick Kravitz, 1650
10 For the record, on 2008-985, on this PUD on
12 and Planning Department's approval as well as
13 the district councilman, and we're also in
14 agreement with the amendments as outlined on
15 December 11th by the Planning Department.
16 THE CHAIRMAN: Thank you, sir.
17 Seeing no further speakers, we'll close
18 that public hearing.
19 MR. WEBB: Move the amendment.
20 THE CHAIRMAN: The amendment has been
21 moved --
22 MR. BROWN: Second.
23 THE CHAIRMAN: -- and seconded.
24 Any further discussion on the amendment?
25 COMMITTEE MEMBERS: (No response.)
Diane M.
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1 THE CHAIRMAN: Seeing none, all in favor
2 say aye.
3 COMMITTEE MEMBERS: Aye.
4 THE CHAIRMAN: Those opposed.
5 COMMITTEE MEMBERS: (No response.)
6 THE CHAIRMAN: By your action, you've
7 approved the amendment.
8 MR. WEBB: Move the bill as amended.
9 MR. JOOST: Second.
10 THE CHAIRMAN: The bill has been moved and
11 seconded as amended.
12 Any further discussion on the bill?
13 COMMITTEE MEMBERS: (No response.)
14 THE CHAIRMAN: Planning Department, you
15 guys good?
16 MR. KELLY: (Nods head.)
17 THE CHAIRMAN: Seeing none, please open the
18 ballot.
19 (Committee ballot opened.)
20 MR. GRAHAM: (Votes yea.)
21 MR. JOOST: (Votes yea.)
22 MR. BROWN: (Votes yea.)
23 MR. REDMAN: (Votes yea.)
24 MR. WEBB: (Votes yea.)
25 THE CHAIRMAN: Close the ballot and record
Diane M.
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1 the vote.
2 (Committee ballot closed.)
3 MS. LAHMEUR: Five yeas, zero nays.
4 THE CHAIRMAN: By your action, you've
5 approved -985 as amended.
6 MR. KRAVITZ: Thank you.
7 THE CHAIRMAN: -986, we'll open the public
8 hearing.
9 We have Claire Bauer.
10 Ma'am, come on down.
11 (Audience member approaches the podium.)
12 THE CHAIRMAN: I need your name and address
13 for the record, and you have three minutes.
14 AUDIENCE MEMBER: Claire Bauer, 4411
16 I have seven objections to this (inaudible)
17 with CVS.
18 THE CHAIRMAN: Ma'am, can you pull that mic
19 in front of you?
20 MS. BAUER: Like this (indicating)?
21 THE CHAIRMAN: Yes. Thanks.
22 MS. BAUER: Okay. One is I definitely and
23 highly object due to the generation of increased
24 traffic on
25 a stop sign at
Diane M.
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1 which I own two houses. Cars don't always stop
2 at the stop sign. They keep going.
3 Number three, we've already had three
4 accidents in front of our house due to cars
5 parked there.
6 Four, we had to report Papa Johns, which is
7 at
8 driving too fast because there's children who
9 play, not many, but I have a grandson who likes
10 to go out and ride his bike and play ball. We
11 keep him on the lawn.
12 And number six is the panhandlers. Right
13 now at CVS there's panhandlers, and they will
14 come over to our house.
15 And I've lived there since 1961. It's a
16 residential area. We've had no problems. It's
17 a quiet area. We like it there. The neighbors
18 are quiet, but we already have more traffic that
19 [sic] we need, and I think CVS should stay where
20 they are.
21 Thank you for giving me the opportunity to
22 speak.
23 THE CHAIRMAN: Ma'am, I've got a question
24 for you.
25 MS. BAUER: Yes.
Diane M.
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1 THE CHAIRMAN: You said this is
2 Boulevard?
3 MS. BAUER: Yes, sir.
I live at
4 and
5 they're on
6
7 THE CHAIRMAN: Okay.
8 MS. BAUER: So they're really on the side
9 of
10 THE CHAIRMAN: Okay. I'm sitting here
11 trying to mentally picture where this thing is.
12 To me, it just doesn't sound like it's a
13 residential area. I mean, it sounds like
14 there's a lot of commercial around there.
15 MS. BAUER: My street's residential.
16 THE CHAIRMAN: Okay. Well, I mean, we're
17 not taking any action on this today anyway.
18 MS. BAUER: No, no.
19 THE CHAIRMAN: Okay.
20 MS. BAUER: Thank you.
21 THE CHAIRMAN: Thanks, ma'am.
22 Seeing no further speakers, we'll continue
23 that public hearing and take no further action.
24 -987, we'll open that public hearing.
25 Mr. Mann.
Diane M.
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1 (Mr. Mann approaches the podium.)
2 MR. MANN: Mr. Chairman, members of the
3 committee, Charles Mann,
4 representing the landowner.
5 We have the Planning Department's support
6 on this. We've had this before you recently,
7 and what we're doing with this PUD is more of a
8 clarification to the wording of the original PUD
9 that was approved by this committee.
10 We're familiar with the conditions that the
11 Planning Department has placed on it. We have
12 one item that we would like to, for
13 clarification, under item 5, where it says that
14 "The full general commercial uses shall be
15 limited to parcel A," add that parcel A contains
16 1.59 acres.
17 Why that's important to my client, I don't
18 know, but he asked that I read that into the
19 record.
20 THE CHAIRMAN: All right, sir. I
21 appreciate it.
22 Do you have the support of your district
23 councilperson as well?
24 MR. MANN: I have talked to him in depth.
25 I'm not sure exactly where he stands. But I'm
Diane M.
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1 sure that if he was opposed to it, I would not
2 be here.
3 THE CHAIRMAN: Well, you'll find out real
4 soon where he stands.
5 Seeing no further speakers, we'll close
6 that public hearing.
7 Can we hear the amendment, please.
8 MR. CROFTS: Yes. Mr. Chairman and members
9 of the committee, the amendment consists of the
10 following conditions:
11 Number 1, "The developer shall be subject
12 to the original legal description dated
13 October 8, 2008."
14 Number 2, "The developer shall be subject
15 to the original written description dated
16 October 8, 2008."
17 Number 3, "The developer shall be subject
18 to the original site plan dated October 8,
19 2008."
20 Number 4, The required transportation
21 improvements shall be made in accordance with
22 the Development Services Memorandum dated
23 November 10, 2008, or as otherwise approved by
24 the traffic engineer and the Planning and
25 Development Department.
Diane M.
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76
1 Condition number 5, "Commercial uses are
2 allowed in parcel A." And as Mr. Mann
3 referenced, that parcel A will consist of
4 1.59 acres, and light industrial and car rental
5 uses are allowed in parcel B.
6 Number 6, "Lighting fixtures shall be flush
7 mounted with full cutoff, screens, and no taller
8 than 20 feet in height."
9 That's it.
10 MR. MANN: And we're in total agreement
11 with that.
12 THE CHAIRMAN: That number 5 is what you --
13 MR. MANN: Yes, sir.
14 THE CHAIRMAN: Okay. That sounds good.
15 Can I get an amendment?
16 MR. WEBB: Move the amendment.
17 MR. JOOST: Second.
18 THE CHAIRMAN: It's been moved and
19 seconded.
20 Any discussion on the amendment?
21 COMMITTEE MEMBERS: (No response.)
22 THE CHAIRMAN: Seeing none, all in favor
23 say aye.
24 COMMITTEE MEMBERS: Aye.
25 THE CHAIRMAN: Those opposed.
Diane M. Tropia,
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1 COMMITTEE MEMBERS: (No response.)
2 THE CHAIRMAN: By your action, you've
3 approved the amendment.
4 MR. WEBB: Move the bill as amended.
5 MR. JOOST: Second.
6 THE CHAIRMAN: The bill has been moved and
7 seconded as amended.
8 Any further discussion on the bill?
9 COMMITTEE MEMBERS: (No response.)
10 THE CHAIRMAN: Seeing none, please open the
11 ballot.
12 (Committee ballot opened.)
13 MR. GRAHAM: (Votes yea.)
14 MR. JOOST: (Votes yea.)
15 MR. BROWN: (Votes yea.)
16 MR. REDMAN: (Votes yea.)
17 MR. WEBB: (Votes yea.)
18 THE CHAIRMAN: Close the ballot and record
19 the vote.
20 (Committee ballot closed.)
21 MS. LAHMEUR: Five yeas, zero nays.
22 THE CHAIRMAN: By your action, you've
23 approved -987.
24 Thank you, Mr. Mann.
25 MR. MANN: Mr. Councilman, committee, thank
Diane M.
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78
1 you very much.
2 THE CHAIRMAN: Top of page 11. -988. We
3 will open that public hearing.
4 Mr. Duggan.
5 (Mr. Duggan approaches the podium.)
6 THE CHAIRMAN: Or should I call you Duggan
7 (pronouncing)?
8 MR. DUGGAN: No, no. Let's go with
9 Duggan. It took five years. Let's not confuse
10 everybody.
11 THE CHAIRMAN: Sir.
12 MR. DUGGAN: Wyman Duggan, 1301 Riverplace
13 Boulevard,
14 Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
15 This is a conventional rezoning of property
16 that is currently owned by the
17 It's within -- it's part of the Bolles campus.
18 It's within their fence line. It's to make this
19 parcel consistent -- the zoning of this parcel
20 consistent with the zoning of the rest of the
21 Bolles campus. Bolles is not a PUD. It's
22 PBF-2. This zoning makes that consistent.
23 We have the support of the district
24 councilman. We've met with some neighbors who
25 live one street over on
Diane M. Tropia,
79
1 Ms. Goller spoke in opposition at Planning
2 Commission, but you'll note did not stay to
3 speak tonight. I think we've addressed her
4 concerns.
5 I'm available for any questions.
6 THE CHAIRMAN: Seeing no questions, we'll
7 close that public hearing.
8 MR. WEBB: Move the bill.
9 MR. JOOST: (Inaudible.)
10 THE CHAIRMAN: Hold on. Mr. Joost has got
11 a question for you.
12 MR. JOOST: I wish to declare ex-parte
13 communications. Before the meeting I spoke to
14 Mr. Duggan, Mr. Spiller of
15 Mr. Norman Young of the
16 discussing aspects of the project.
17 THE CHAIRMAN: Very good.
18 Okay. Can I get someone to move this
19 bill?
20 MR. WEBB: Move the bill.
21 MR. JOOST: Second.
22 THE CHAIRMAN: The bill has been moved and
23 seconded.
24 Any further -- any discussion on the bill?
25 COMMITTEE MEMBERS: (No response.)
Diane M.
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1 THE CHAIRMAN: Seeing none, please open the
2 ballot.
3 (Committee ballot opened.)
4 MR. GRAHAM: (Votes yea.)
5 MR. JOOST: (Votes yea.)
6 MR. BROWN: (Votes yea.)
7 MR. REDMAN: (Votes yea.)
8 MR. WEBB: (Votes yea.)
9 THE CHAIRMAN: Close the ballot and record
10 the vote.
11 (Committee ballot closed.)
12 MS. LAHMEUR: Five yeas, zero nays.
13 THE CHAIRMAN: By your action, you've
14 approved -988.
15 Thank you, sir.
16 MR. DUGGAN: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
17 I have the next bill as well.
18 THE CHAIRMAN: -989, we'll open the public
19 hearing.
20 Mr. Duggan.
21 MR. DUGGAN: Wyman Duggan, 1301 Riverplace
22 Boulevard,
23 This parcel is also owned by the Bolles
24 School. It's currently a single-family
25 structure that the school has owned for a
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1 while. They would like to change the zoning of
2 it to convert it into administrative office
3 uses, consistent with several other structures
4 in the immediate vicinity where they've done the
5 same thing.
6 I'm available for questions.
7 THE CHAIRMAN: Thank you, sir.
8 We will close that public hearing, and let
9 the record show that Mr. Joost has declared
10 ex-parte communications for both -88 and -89.
11 MR. WEBB: Move the bill.
12 MR. JOOST: Second.
13 THE CHAIRMAN: It's been moved and
14 seconded.
15 Any discussion on the bill?
16 COMMITTEE MEMBERS: (No response.)
17 THE CHAIRMAN: Seeing none, please open the
18 ballot.
19 (Committee ballot opened.)
20 MR. GRAHAM: (Votes yea.)
21 MR. JOOST: (Votes yea.)
22 MR. BROWN: (Votes yea.)
23 MR. REDMAN: (Votes yea.)
24 MR. WEBB: (Votes yea.)
25 THE CHAIRMAN: Close the ballot and record
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1 the vote.
2 (Committee ballot closed.)
3 MS. LAHMEUR: Five yeas, zero nays.
4 THE CHAIRMAN: By your action, you've
5 approved 2008-989.
6 Thank you, sir.
7 MR. DUGGAN: Thank you.
8 THE CHAIRMAN: Let's skip over to the
9 bottom of page 14, 2008-1049.
10 Open the public hearing.
11 Duncan Ross, questions only.
12 MR. ROSS: Yes.
13 THE CHAIRMAN: Seeing no questions for
14 Mr. Ross, we will close that public hearing.
15 MR. JOOST: Move the bill.
16 MR. WEBB: Second.
17 THE CHAIRMAN: It's been moved and
18 seconded.
19 Any discussion on the bill?
20 COMMITTEE MEMBERS: (No response.)
21 THE CHAIRMAN: Seeing none, please open the
22 ballot.
23 (Committee ballot opened.)
24 MR. GRAHAM: (Votes yea.)
25 MR. JOOST: (Votes yea.)
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1 MR. BROWN: (Votes yea.)
2 MR. REDMAN: (Votes yea.)
3 MR. WEBB: (Votes yea.)
4 THE CHAIRMAN: Close the ballot and record
5 the vote.
6 (Committee ballot closed.)
7 MS. LAHMEUR: Five yeas, zero nays.
8 THE CHAIRMAN: By your action, you have
9 approved -1049.
10 Thank you, sir.
11 -1050. Open the public hearing.
12 Seeing no speakers, we'll continue that
13 public hearing and take no further action.
14 Top of page 15, -1051. Open that public
15 hearing.
16 Ms. Johnston.
17 (Ms. Johnston approaches the podium.)
18 THE CHAIRMAN: How do. Happy New Year.
19 MS. JOHNSTON: Thank you. Same to you.
20
21 Suite 1500, on behalf of the applicant.
22 Mr. Graham likes it when I'm brief, so I'll
23 be brief and just be here for questions.
24 THE CHAIRMAN: Seeing no questions, we will
25 close that public hearing.
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1 Do you have the support of your district
2 councilperson?
3 MS. JOHNSTON: I spoke with him this
4 afternoon, and I think he is in support. I will
5 let him answer that directly.
6 THE CHAIRMAN: Hold on a second. You'll
7 find out in just a second.
8 Mr. Redman.
9 MR. REDMAN: Yes, I am in support, and I
10 guess I need to declare ex-parte.
11 THE CHAIRMAN: Thank you, sir.
12 Any questions of Mr. Redman's ex-parte?
13 COMMITTEE MEMBERS: (No response.)
14 THE CHAIRMAN: Seeing none, can we get
15 somebody to move the bill?
16 MR. WEBB: Move the bill.
17 MR. BROWN: Second.
18 THE CHAIRMAN: The bill has been moved and
19 seconded.
20 Any discussion on the bill?
21 COMMITTEE MEMBERS: (No response.)
22 THE CHAIRMAN: Seeing none, please open the
23 ballot.
24 (Committee ballot opened.)
25 MR. GRAHAM: (Votes yea.)
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1 MR. JOOST: (Votes yea.)
2 MR. BROWN: (Votes yea.)
3 MR. REDMAN: (Votes yea.)
4 MR. WEBB: (Votes yea.)
5 THE CHAIRMAN: Close the ballot and record
6 the vote.
7 (Committee ballot closed.)
8 MS. LAHMEUR: Five yeas, zero nays.
9 THE CHAIRMAN: By your action, you have
10 approved 2008-1051.
11 Thank you, ma'am.
12 MS. JOHNSTON: Thank you. Have a good
13 night.
14 THE CHAIRMAN: And I believe that concludes
15 our agenda, unless somebody has something
16 arbitrary they want to talk about.
17 COMMITTEE MEMBERS: (No response.)
18 THE CHAIRMAN: Seeing none, we're
19 adjourned.
20 (The above proceedings were adjourned at
21 6:20 p.m.)
22 - - -
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1 C E R T I F I C A T E
2
3 STATE OF
4 COUNTY OF DUVAL :
5
6 I, Diane M. Tropia, certify that I was
7 authorized to and did stenographically report the
8 foregoing proceedings and that the transcript is a
9 true and complete record of my stenographic notes.
10 Dated this 11th day of January, 2009.
11
12
13
14 Diane M. Tropia
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Diane M.
Tropia,