CITY OF JACKSONVILLE

 

                                LAND USE AND ZONING

 

                                     COMMITTEE

 

 

 

 

 

                          Proceedings held on Tuesday, April 5,

 

                2011, commencing at 5:06 p.m., City Hall, Council

 

                Chambers, 1st Floor, Jacksonville, Florida, before

 

                Diane M. Tropia, a Notary Public in and for the

 

                State of Florida at Large.

 

 

 

                PRESENT:

 

                     JOHN CRESCIMBENI, Chair.

                     DON REDMAN, Committee Member.

                     STEPHEN JOOST, Committee Member.

                     REGINALD BROWN, Committee Member.

 

 

                ALSO PRESENT:

 

                     JOHN CROFTS, Deputy Director, Planning Dept.

                     SEAN KELLY, Chief, Current Planning.

                     FOLKS HUXFORD, Zoning Administrator.

                     KEN AVERY, Planning and Development Dept.

                     DYLAN REINGOLD, Office of General Counsel.

                     MERRIANE LAHMEUR, Legislative Assistant.

                     SHARONDA DAVIS, Legislative Assistant.

 

 

 

                                       - - -


 

                                                                  2

 

 

 

             1                 P R O C E E D I N G S

 

             2  April 5, 2011                             5:06 p.m.

 

             3                         - - -

 

             4           THE CHAIRMAN:  All right.  Good evening,

 

             5      everyone.

 

             6           We're going to begin the Land Use and

 

             7      Zoning meeting of Tuesday, April 5th, 2011.

 

             8           I have a quorum at this point, so we will

 

             9      start by everybody introducing themselves on

 

            10      the record, and we'll begin with Mr. Crofts.

 

            11           MR. CROFTS:  Good evening.

 

            12           My name is John Crofts, and I'm deputy

 

            13      director of Planning.

 

            14           Thank you.

 

            15           MR. KELLY:  Sean Kelly, Planning and

 

            16      Development.

 

            17           MR. HUXFORD:  Folks Huxford, Planning and

 

            18      Development.

 

            19           MR. AVERY:  Ken Avery, Planning and

 

            20      Development.

 

            21           MR. REINGOLD:  Dylan Reingold with the

 

            22      Office of General Counsel.

 

            23           MR. JOOST:  Stephen Joost, City Council,

 

            24      Group 3.

 

            25           MR. BROWN:  Reginald Brown, District 10.


 

                                                                       3

 

 

 

             1           THE CHAIRMAN:  I'm John Crescimbeni,

 

             2      at-large, Group 2.

 

             3           MR. REDMAN:  Don Redman, District 4.

 

             4           THE CHAIRMAN:  All right.  Thank you.

 

             5           Welcome, everyone.

 

             6           And we have a council member that's joined

 

             7      us in the audience, sitting way, way out there

 

             8      in the back.  She should be on the front row,

 

             9      Ms. Lori Boyer, who will be the new council

 

            10      member on July 1 for District 5.

 

            11           So we welcome you here tonight.  Thank you

 

            12      for showing an interest in the Land Use and

 

            13      Zoning Committee, and congratulations on your

 

            14      election to the City Council.

 

            15           For a minute there I thought we might have

 

            16      to get you up here on the panel tonight.  We

 

            17      have to have four, so --

 

            18           Mr. Reingold, we have one public hearing

 

            19      tonight.  The participant is not here.  Do we

 

            20      do the instructions or not?

 

            21           MR. REINGOLD:  I always do the

 

            22      instructions at your pleasure, sir.

 

            23           THE CHAIRMAN:  I'm just looking for legal

 

            24      advice, so --

 

            25           MR. REINGOLD:  If I notice anything that

 

                Diane M. Tropia, Inc., P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

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             1      goes out of control, I will certainly say

 

             2      something.

 

             3           THE CHAIRMAN:  All right.  So we will --

 

             4      we will temporarily pass over the LUZ

 

             5      instructions, which we predicted may last

 

             6      longer that the rest of the meeting.

 

             7           All right.  Page 2, item 1, we have a

 

             8      public hearing scheduled this evening.  I have

 

             9      no speakers' cards.  The public hearing is

 

            10      continued until June 7th, and there's no

 

            11      further action on that bill.

 

            12           Items 2 and 3 are both deferred tonight.

 

            13           Turning to page 3, at the top, item 4,

 

            14      2011-38, that is deferred.

 

            15           Item 5, 2011-40.  We have no public

 

            16      hearing this evening.  The committee adopted

 

            17      this at our last meeting three weeks ago.  It

 

            18      went to the council for -- there was some

 

            19      concern about the need for an additional

 

            20      condition, so it's been rereferred back to LUZ.

 

            21           Mr. Kelly, do you want give a report on

 

            22      that?

 

            23           Mr. Cribbs, you might as well come up to

 

            24      the podium, please.

 

            25           (Mr. Cribbs approaches the podium.)

 

                Diane M. Tropia, Inc., P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

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             1           MR. KELLY:  Thank you.

 

             2           To the Chair and Committee, again

 

             3      ordinance 2011-40 seeks a reduction in the

 

             4      required minimum road frontage from eighty feet

 

             5      to zero feet.  As you know, the Department had

 

             6      originally recommended denial of this

 

             7      application.  After considerable debate, the

 

             8      committee looked -- I think it was under

 

             9      Councilman Brown, Dick Brown, that -- they were

 

            10      looking for conditions which would alleviate or

 

            11      remove that denial that could, you know,

 

            12      benefit the public health and safety and -- and

 

            13      ultimately be consistent with the -- the

 

            14      criteria for the waiver.

 

            15           The Department, in concert with the Office

 

            16      of General Counsel, has gone over that.  We

 

            17      have -- I don't know if Dylan has handed it

 

            18      out.  There's an amendment proposed, which is

 

            19      basically consisting of about five or six

 

            20      conditions.  I can read them into the record.

 

            21      I do have a -- an issue with some of the

 

            22      verbiage on the very first part, so I will read

 

            23      into the record the condition that's

 

            24      proposed -- the conditions that are proposed

 

            25      right now.

 

                Diane M. Tropia, Inc., P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

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             1           The -- condition 1 would be --

 

             2           THE CHAIRMAN:  Mr. Kelly, are any of the

 

             3      conditions you're about to read in ones that we

 

             4      have already approved verbatim or have they all

 

             5      changed?

 

             6           MR. KELLY:  They're -- there's a

 

             7      modification to the first one.  Conditions B,

 

             8      C, D, and E would be the same.

 

             9           MR. REINGOLD:  No.

 

            10           THE CHAIRMAN:  Okay.  Let's go ahead and

 

            11      read them all into the record, then, since we

 

            12      already have a difference of opinion between

 

            13      staff and legal counsel.  So, I'm sorry to

 

            14      interrupt, go ahead, read them in.

 

            15           MR. KELLY:  The first condition, as

 

            16      proposed, reads, "The accessway to the subject

 

            17      property shall be 25 feet wide and maintained

 

            18      by the applicant as a stabilized travel surface

 

            19      that does not alter the existing drainage

 

            20      patterns, subject to review and approval of the

 

            21      Planning and Development Department and subject

 

            22      to confirmation that the applicant has a legal

 

            23      right to improve the 25-foot-wide accessway and

 

            24      use the same for vehicular and pedestrian

 

            25      access to the subject property prior to the

 

                Diane M. Tropia, Inc., P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

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             1      granting of a permit for the residence.  The

 

             2      accessway shall be improved to meet this

 

             3      requirement within 12 months of the granting of

 

             4      a permit for the residence.

 

             5           "To the extent that any portion of the

 

             6      25-foot-wide accessway is owned by the City of

 

             7      Jacksonville, then, prior to work, the

 

             8      applicant shall have executed and delivered to

 

             9      the City of Jacksonville an agreement as

 

            10      approved by the City of the [sic] Jacksonville

 

            11      Office of General Counsel and Risk Management.

 

            12           Condition B --

 

            13           THE CHAIRMAN:  All right.  You want to

 

            14      just take that one up and -- so Condition A,

 

            15      Mr. Reingold, do you have a difference of

 

            16      opinion on the verbiage?

 

            17           MR. REINGOLD:  One small change to A that

 

            18      I would recommend.  It was actually based upon

 

            19      a discussion I had with the applicant, was

 

            20      breaking up the first sentence a little bit,

 

            21      was -- after "subject to the review and

 

            22      approval of the Planning and Development

 

            23      Department, the applicant shall provide

 

            24      confirmation that the applicant has the legal

 

            25      right to improve the 25-foot-wide accessway,"

 

                Diane M. Tropia, Inc., P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

                                                                       8

 

 

 

             1      and it continues from there.  It just breaks up

 

             2      the sentence and makes it --

 

             3           THE CHAIRMAN:  Thank you, Mr. Reingold.

 

             4           Are you okay with that, Mr. Kelly?

 

             5           MR. CROFTS:  Yes.

 

             6           THE CHAIRMAN:  All right.  Any questions

 

             7      from the committee on Condition A?

 

             8           COMMITTEE MEMBERS:  (No response.)

 

             9           THE CHAIRMAN:  Mr. Cribbs, are you okay --

 

            10      do you accept Condition A?

 

            11           MR. CRIBBS:  I was actually going to ask,

 

            12      when it became my turn to talk, that we just

 

            13      get rid of Condition A altogether.

 

            14           THE CHAIRMAN:  Okay.

 

            15           MR. CRIBBS:  I've got some reasons for

 

            16      that I'll share with you in a moment.

 

            17           THE CHAIRMAN:  Okay.

 

            18           MR. CRIBBS:  And some -- and also, I've

 

            19      brought some photographs in to show, if I could

 

            20      do that.

 

            21           THE CHAIRMAN:  All right.  Mr. Kelly,

 

            22      Condition B?

 

            23           MR. KELLY:  Condition B is, "The accessway

 

            24      to the subject property shall be named and a

 

            25      street sign placed at the interaction with

 

                Diane M. Tropia, Inc., P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

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             1      103rd Street, subject to the review and

 

             2      approval of the Planning and Development

 

             3      Department."

 

             4           Condition C, "The address for the subject

 

             5      property shall be clearly identified on the" --

 

             6      "on 103rd Street, subject to the review and

 

             7      approval of the Planning and Development

 

             8      Department."

 

             9           Condition D, "The subject property shall

 

            10      not be further subdivided unless the accessway

 

            11      is dedicated to the City as a public

 

            12      right-of-way meeting all City standards or is

 

            13      maintained as an approved private street

 

            14      meeting all City standards.

 

            15           "The applicant shall execute and record in

 

            16      the public records a declaration of restrictive

 

            17      covenants in the form approved by the City

 

            18      Council" -- or "City of Jacksonville Office of

 

            19      General Counsel prior to the granting of a

 

            20      permit for the residence on the subject

 

            21      property."

 

            22           Condition E, "The private driveway from

 

            23      the accessway, which is located on the subject

 

            24      property, shall be 15 feet wide and maintained

 

            25      by the applicant as a stabilized travel surface

 

                Diane M. Tropia, Inc., P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

                                                                      10

 

 

 

             1      that does not alter the existing drainage

 

             2      patterns, subject to the review and approval of

 

             3      the Planning and Development Department.

 

             4           "Private driveways shall be improved to

 

             5      meet this requirement within 12 months of the

 

             6      granting of a permit for the residence, "and

 

             7      then the -- the amendment would be to add those

 

             8      conditions.

 

             9           THE CHAIRMAN:  Thank you, Mr. Kelly.

 

            10           Mr. Reingold, any other comments on those

 

            11      conditions?

 

            12           MR. REINGOLD:  No, sir.

 

            13           THE CHAIRMAN:  All right.  Any questions

 

            14      from the committee?

 

            15           MR. JOOST:  Yes.

 

            16           THE CHAIRMAN:  Mr. Joost.

 

            17           MR. JOOST:  Thank you.

 

            18           What is Condition A again?  Since we're

 

            19      about to get into it.

 

            20           MR. KELLY:  Condition A is basically

 

            21      requesting the applicant to improve the

 

            22      easement, which --

 

            23           MR. JOOST:  Which is a dirt road you see

 

            24      there?

 

            25           MR. KELLY:  Right.  That's property he

 

                Diane M. Tropia, Inc., P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

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             1      doesn't have title to, but to improve that --

 

             2           MR. JOOST:  And who has title to it?

 

             3           MR. KELLY:  It is an old Jacksonville

 

             4      Heights right-of-way, so it's City -- City

 

             5      owned but not maintained.

 

             6           MR. JOOST:  Okay.

 

             7           MR. REINGOLD:  I'm not sure that's

 

             8      entirely a true statement.

 

             9           On the property appraiser's website, there

 

            10      appears to be a strip of land that is public

 

            11      right-of-way.  There also appears to be a small

 

            12      strip of land that appears to be owned by four

 

            13      or five separate individuals, and it -- and

 

            14      part of the -- the way that the condition reads

 

            15      is that, if you're going to be working on City

 

            16      property, you need to make sure that you enter

 

            17      into the proper agreements with the City to be

 

            18      working on the public right-of-way.

 

            19           The other aspect of the condition is that,

 

            20      if you're working on the other piece of --

 

            21      strip that appears to be a privately-owned

 

            22      easement, we want to make sure that we see that

 

            23      we -- you've got the right to improve and even

 

            24      use that easement before you start working on

 

            25      it so that there's not a trespass issue, which

 

                Diane M. Tropia, Inc., P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

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             1      completely circumvents everything --

 

             2           (Simultaneous speaking.)

 

             3           MR. JOOST:  I guess that would be my next

 

             4      question.  How can we improve property we don't

 

             5      own?

 

             6           MR. REINGOLD:  And the response to that is

 

             7      that we want to see, up front, before they

 

             8      start working, that they do have the right to

 

             9      either access the private property or have the

 

            10      proper agreement on the public property.

 

            11           MR. JOOST:  Okay.  Or just drop

 

            12      Condition A.

 

            13           MR. REINGOLD:  Well, the -- I believe --

 

            14      and certainly the Planning Department can speak

 

            15      to this issue.  There -- one of the main issues

 

            16      that you have with a waiver of road frontage is

 

            17      that you need to have a valid and effective --

 

            18           (Simultaneous speaking.)

 

            19           MR. JOOST:  -- (inaudible) subdivision --

 

            20           MR. REINGOLD:  Well, you need to have

 

            21      valid --

 

            22           MR. JOOST:  A subdivision that doesn't

 

            23      meet the City code.  I got it.

 

            24           Okay.  Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

 

            25           THE CHAIRMAN:  Thank you, Mr. Joost.

 

                Diane M. Tropia, Inc., P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

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             1           Mr. Reingold, Condition A, though, isn't

 

             2      that necessary to have access to and from your

 

             3      parcel?  I mean, isn't that, like, the key,

 

             4      that you have to have either right-of-way

 

             5      that's owned but not maintained or some sort of

 

             6      agreement with the privately-owned property to

 

             7      get back and forth to your property?

 

             8           MR. REINGOLD:  To the Chair, that's

 

             9      correct.

 

            10           One of the four criteria that the LUZ

 

            11      Committee has to review and the Planning

 

            12      Department reviews is that there's a valid and

 

            13      effective easement for adequate vehicular

 

            14      access connected to a public street or approved

 

            15      private roadway.

 

            16           What A is doing is providing that.  It's

 

            17      saying, look, you've got to demonstrate to us

 

            18      that you've got an agreement with the City or

 

            19      you have this valid and effective easement.

 

            20      And then adequacy is based upon the -- it's got

 

            21      to be 25 foot wide and it needs to be improved.

 

            22      So all those are sort of wrapping in so that it

 

            23      meets that condition.

 

            24           THE CHAIRMAN:  Okay.

 

            25           All right.  Any other questions from the

 

                Diane M. Tropia, Inc., P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

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             1      committee?

 

             2           COMMITTEE MEMBERS:  (No response.)

 

             3           THE CHAIRMAN:  All right.  Mr. Cribbs, do

 

             4      you accept conditions B, C, D, and E?

 

             5           MR. CRIBBS:  Yes, sir.

 

             6           THE CHAIRMAN:  Okay.

 

             7           All right.  Well, tell us about

 

             8      Condition A.

 

             9           MR. CRIBBS:  Um --

 

            10           THE CHAIRMAN:  You understand what the

 

            11      General Counsel is saying with regard to --

 

            12           MR. CRIBBS:  (Nods head.)

 

            13           THE CHAIRMAN:  All right.

 

            14           MR. CRIBBS:  Yes, sir.

 

            15           That -- actually, that last statement made

 

            16      the most sense to me, and I -- I mean, I can

 

            17      clearly see why that's important, but this

 

            18      public easement from 103rd has been in place

 

            19      probably for 20 years.  I know my neighbor has

 

            20      lived there that long.  It is a stabilized

 

            21      surface.  It does provide adequate ingress and

 

            22      egress to all those -- there's -- there's only

 

            23      a few folks living in there.  It's a dead end.

 

            24           I guess my argument is it doesn't need to

 

            25      be improved any further than it already is.  I

 

                Diane M. Tropia, Inc., P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

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             1      have a 14-by-76 mobile home, and my mover is

 

             2      not even concerned about getting it in there.

 

             3           I -- I've brought those photographs.  One

 

             4      of them is looking back towards 103rd Street,

 

             5      and you'll see that it has a paved surface with

 

             6      concrete curbs, a double-yellow line.  That,

 

             7      from curb to curb, is what 25 feet looks like.

 

             8           Now, some of the other ones are going --

 

             9      looking down the dirt road, and I -- I believe

 

            10      I measured the -- just the dirt travel path is

 

            11      probably about 16 feet, but you can see that

 

            12      there's grass on either side and it's

 

            13      relatively flat.  And, you know, if I'm coming

 

            14      in and a neighbor is going out, we have room to

 

            15      pass.

 

            16           My only concern was, if I get into trying

 

            17      to make a 25-foot road, it's going to eat up

 

            18      every bit of space from the row of power poles

 

            19      to the left all the way to the existing ditch

 

            20      on the right, which is really on somebody

 

            21      else's property, and I -- and I -- I just hope

 

            22      that maybe we could drop that off of my

 

            23      requirements and -- it seems like a -- an

 

            24      unnecessary complication for me at this moment

 

            25      in time.

 

                Diane M. Tropia, Inc., P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

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             1           THE CHAIRMAN:  Thank you, Mr. Cribbs.

 

             2           Mr. Joost, do you have a question?

 

             3           MR. JOOST:  Yes.  Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

 

             4           I guess to clarify, through legal, is --

 

             5      you're saying -- I mean, we could drop the part

 

             6      where it says he has to improve it, I guess, if

 

             7      you will, but he still has to demonstrate the

 

             8      fact that he -- even a de facto or whatever --

 

             9      he's been using it for 20 years.  We're still

 

            10      saying to him, he has to demonstrate to us, in

 

            11      writing, that he has easement rights to it; is

 

            12      that correct?

 

            13           MR. REINGOLD:  (Nods head.)

 

            14           MR. JOOST:  I mean, we have to -- I mean,

 

            15      the law requires us to do that?

 

            16           MR. REINGOLD:  And that -- actually,

 

            17      that -- there's actually two aspects.  One, we

 

            18      would want to confirm the proper access to his

 

            19      property; and two, we may not -- the chair --

 

            20      the committee may not desire that he improve

 

            21      it, but there may be a request that he maintain

 

            22      it, you know, in a certain format.  At which

 

            23      point, if he's requested to maintain that, we'd

 

            24      want to make sure that he was in agreement, you

 

            25      had proper agreements with the City to be

 

                Diane M. Tropia, Inc., P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

                                                                      17

 

 

 

             1      working in the right-of-way or on someone

 

             2      else's property.

 

             3           MR. JOOST:  And I guess the problem comes

 

             4      in is -- the one in a million times --

 

             5      hopefully it's not more than that -- where you

 

             6      have to call 911 and the emergency vehicle

 

             7      can't get down there.  I think that's the main

 

             8      part for the 25 feet, is what those -- you

 

             9      know, a large ladder truck is going to require

 

            10      to get back there.

 

            11           So, I mean, it looks to me right now --

 

            12      it's okay, but I would still want to make sure

 

            13      we have an easement to it, you know, and -- and

 

            14      we're not getting the City in any situation.

 

            15           Just because the road has been there for

 

            16      25 years, nobody has granted us permission to

 

            17      get back there, or really granted you -- it's

 

            18      even more to -- more so to protect yourself.

 

            19      You know, I mean, let -- how big is that

 

            20      parcel, 15 acres?

 

            21           MR. CRIBBS:  Yes, sir.

 

            22           MR. JOOST:  I mean, I'd hate to see in,

 

            23      you know, 10 or 15, 20 years from now real

 

            24      estate gets, you know, back on track and all of

 

            25      a sudden, you know, that -- you've got a

 

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             1      valuable piece -- I mean, a really valuable

 

             2      piece of property and it's -- you know, if you

 

             3      wanted to sell it, you're going to have to be

 

             4      able to demonstrate, you know, to a developer

 

             5      or whatever it may be that you have a proper

 

             6      easement back there.  So, you know, it's even

 

             7      more -- more so to protect yourself than it is

 

             8      us.

 

             9           MR. CRIBBS:  Right.

 

            10           MR. JOOST:  And so I think a compromise

 

            11      may be, you know, just to maintain it as is.  I

 

            12      mean, I'm not seeing it myself, but those

 

            13      pictures look -- look like it's -- you know,

 

            14      it's fairly well-maintained and on gravel road,

 

            15      but I -- you know, just to protect the City and

 

            16      really even to protect yourself, I still think

 

            17      we should get written -- something written into

 

            18      the record where we have those easement rights.

 

            19           THE CHAIRMAN:  Thank you, Mr. Joost.

 

            20           Mr. Redman.

 

            21           MR. REDMAN:  Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

 

            22           Mr. Cribbs, you say there's some other

 

            23      residents back down this road?

 

            24           MR. CRIBBS:  Yes, sir.  There's a few

 

            25      other folks living in there.

 

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             1           MR. REDMAN:  Okay.  Are they utilizing

 

             2      this road to get to their residence?

 

             3           MR. CRIBBS:  Yes, sir.

 

             4           MR. REDMAN:  All right.  Do any of them

 

             5      have ownership to any part of this road or the

 

             6      land --

 

             7           MR. CRIBBS:  Yes, sir.

 

             8           MR. REDMAN:  -- alongside the road?

 

             9           MR. CRIBBS:  Behind the gas station there

 

            10      is a mobile home, but I'm not for sure if

 

            11      someone lives there, but there is a second

 

            12      double-wide mobile home owned by Vertie Smith.

 

            13      That little strip of land on that right side of

 

            14      that public easement extends nearly --

 

            15      always -- all the way past my entrance to my

 

            16      property, and she does own that.  It runs

 

            17      parallel with the public easement and it

 

            18      appears to be one, you know -- you just can't

 

            19      see it, that -- she owns the right half.

 

            20           MR. REDMAN:  Have you talked with her and

 

            21      discussed the uses that you want to use?

 

            22           MR. CRIBBS:  I had written up a statement.

 

            23           Basically, she declared that I could use

 

            24      her -- I just use the RE number for her

 

            25      property.  I can use that RE number to ingress

 

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             1      and egress my RE number was the basic principle

 

             2      on that, but nothing about improving it or

 

             3      changing her property, just -- just that I

 

             4      would have access.

 

             5           MR. REDMAN:  Yeah.  I mean, this road

 

             6      looks sufficient to get a fire engine down or

 

             7      anything, but -- yeah, I --

 

             8           MR. CRIBBS:  My neighbors have offered

 

             9      several times to come in and attest that they

 

            10      have had the fire department out there on more

 

            11      than one occasion.  And I can tell you, my wife

 

            12      drives a '97 Accord and she is not going to let

 

            13      me get -- let the road get to the condition

 

            14      where she can't get in there with it, and so

 

            15      far she's satisfied.

 

            16           MR. REDMAN:  Yeah.  All right.

 

            17           Thank you.

 

            18           THE CHAIRMAN:  Thank you, Mr. Redman.

 

            19           Mr. Reingold, any possibility we can

 

            20      accommodate Mr. Joost's suggestion in that

 

            21      Condition A?  I saw you scribbling over there.

 

            22      I thought maybe you might be trying to work on

 

            23      that.

 

            24           MR. REINGOLD:  Well, I guess one of the

 

            25      issues could be -- is -- whether there's a

 

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             1      discussion amongst the committee members about

 

             2      the 20-foot-wide requirement.  You know, if

 

             3      you're happy with the current width, whatever

 

             4      that is -- and I'll defer to the applicant and

 

             5      to the Planning Department -- that may be one

 

             6      sort of solution.  Another solution may be

 

             7      that -- instead of having to improve it, that

 

             8      we just require that the applicant maintain it

 

             9      in its current form.  Those might be some of

 

            10      the possibilities.

 

            11           I still think it would be important to

 

            12      have a condition that if they are actually

 

            13      working in the right-of-way that they have an

 

            14      agreement with the City, or if they're actually

 

            15      doing some sort of work or using someone else's

 

            16      property that they at least provide that

 

            17      information to the City.

 

            18           And the only reason why I raise that is

 

            19      the -- the document referenced by the applicant

 

            20      just says, I, Vertie Smith, do hereby grant

 

            21      Bryan A. Cribbs easement across my property,

 

            22      and then with the RE number, for ingress and

 

            23      egress of his property.  Dated this day, blank.

 

            24      I mean, there's no sort of even looking at, is

 

            25      that even possible over that property and --

 

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             1      and those things.  We would just like the

 

             2      ability to sort of tie up that loose end.

 

             3           THE CHAIRMAN:  Thank you, Mr. Reingold.

 

             4           Mr. Redman.

 

             5           MR. REDMAN:  Well, I would make a motion

 

             6      that we -- as long as he maintains it at the

 

             7      level that it is and provides the proper

 

             8      information that Mr. Reingold was talking

 

             9      about, maybe a legal -- more of a legal

 

            10      description of what your neighbor is allowing

 

            11      you to do -- would that be sufficient,

 

            12      Mr. Reingold?

 

            13           MR. JOOST:  (Inaudible.)

 

            14           THE CHAIRMAN:  He's working on it.

 

            15           MR. REDMAN:  Okay.  Well, I would make

 

            16      that motion.

 

            17           MR. JOOST:  Second.

 

            18           THE CHAIRMAN:  Motion by Mr. Redman,

 

            19      second by Mr. Joost.

 

            20           Mr. Kelly, you had your hand up.

 

            21           MR. KELLY:  Yeah.  I was just assessing

 

            22      the -- the status of the condition, that --

 

            23      essentially the condition would read, "The

 

            24      existing accessway shall be maintained and

 

            25      stabilized and any work performed in the City

 

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             1      right-of-way shall be subject to Planning and

 

             2      Development Department review and approval."

 

             3           MR. JOOST:  Or the neighbors right-of-way.

 

             4      I'm not sure (inaudible) --

 

             5           MR. KELLY:  The -- there's a 9-foot strip

 

             6      that's owned by the neighbor -- Vertie, you

 

             7      said?

 

             8           MR. CRIBBS:  Vertie Smith.

 

             9           MR. KELLY:  And then the other 26, 20 --

 

            10      or 17 or 18 feet is City on the west half,

 

            11      so, I mean --

 

            12           THE CHAIRMAN:  Thank you, Mr. Kelly.

 

            13           Mr. Reingold.

 

            14           MR. REINGOLD:  "The accessway to the

 

            15      subject property shall be maintained in its

 

            16      current state.  The applicant shall provide

 

            17      confirmation that the applicant has the legal

 

            18      right to improve or maintain the accessway and

 

            19      use the same for vehicular and pedestrian

 

            20      access to the subject property prior to the

 

            21      granting of a permit for the residence.

 

            22           "To the extent that any portion of the

 

            23      accessway is owned by the City of Jacksonville,

 

            24      the" -- "prior to any work, the applicant shall

 

            25      have executed and delivered to the City of

 

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             1      Jacksonville an agreement as approved by the

 

             2      City of Jacksonville Office of General Counsel

 

             3      and Risk Management."

 

             4           THE CHAIRMAN:  Mr. Redman, was that your

 

             5      amendment?

 

             6           MR. REDMAN:  Yes.  Sounds good.

 

             7           THE CHAIRMAN:  Mr. Joost?

 

             8           MR. JOOST:  (Nods head.)

 

             9           THE CHAIRMAN:  That would be the new

 

            10      Condition A.

 

            11           Mr. Cribbs, do you accept that?

 

            12           MR. CRIBBS:  Yes, sir.

 

            13           THE CHAIRMAN:  Okay.  So you accept that

 

            14      condition, and the other four, B, C, D and E,

 

            15      correct?

 

            16           MR. CRIBBS:  Yes, sir.

 

            17           THE CHAIRMAN:  All right.

 

            18           Thank you.

 

            19           All right.  On --

 

            20           MR. JOOST:  (Inaudible.)

 

            21           THE CHAIRMAN:  On the amendment, all those

 

            22      in favor, say yes.

 

            23           COMMITTEE MEMBERS:  Yes.

 

            24           THE CHAIRMAN:  Opposed, say no.

 

            25           COMMITTEE MEMBERS:  (No response.)

 

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             1           THE CHAIRMAN:  By your action, you have

 

             2      adopted the change to Amendment A.

 

             3           Would someone like to move the bill with

 

             4      the --

 

             5           MR. JOOST:  I was just going to say, why

 

             6      don't you wrap all the amendments into one.

 

             7           THE CHAIRMAN:  Okay.

 

             8           MR. REINGOLD:  The amendment essentially

 

             9      is to grant the waiver subject to the

 

            10      conditions, modified A, B, C, and E, so --

 

            11           THE CHAIRMAN:  Okay.  So --

 

            12           MR. JOOST:  Move to grant the waiver

 

            13      subject to the conditions.

 

            14           MR. BROWN:  Second.

 

            15           THE CHAIRMAN:  All right.  Motion by

 

            16      Mr. Joost, second by Mr. Brown.

 

            17           That's on the amendment, correct?

 

            18           MR. REINGOLD:  (Nods head.)

 

            19           THE CHAIRMAN:  New amendment.  That

 

            20      incorporates the Redman Amendment.

 

            21           All those in favor, say yes.

 

            22           COMMITTEE MEMBERS:  Yes.

 

            23           THE CHAIRMAN:  Opposed, say no.

 

            24           COMMITTEE MEMBERS:  (No response.)

 

            25           THE CHAIRMAN:  By your action, you have

 

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             1      adopted the amendment to grant the waiver with

 

             2      the five conditions.

 

             3           Motion on the bill?

 

             4           MR. JOOST:  Move the bill as amended to

 

             5      grant the waiver.

 

             6           MR. REDMAN:  Second.

 

             7           THE CHAIRMAN:  Motion on the bill as

 

             8      amended by Mr. Joost, second by Mr. Redman.

 

             9           Discussion?

 

            10           COMMITTEE MEMBERS:  (No response.)

 

            11           THE CHAIRMAN:  If not, open the ballot,

 

            12      vote.

 

            13           (Committee ballot opened.)

 

            14           MR. CRESCIMBENI:  (Votes yea.)

 

            15           MR. BROWN:  (Votes yea.)

 

            16           MR. JOOST:  (Votes yea.)

 

            17           MR. REDMAN:  (Votes yea.)

 

            18           (Committee ballot closed.)

 

            19           MS. LAHMEUR:  Four yeas, zero nay.

 

            20           THE CHAIRMAN:  By your action, you have

 

            21      approved, once again, item 2011-38.

 

            22           Now, Mr. Cribbs, this is going to go back

 

            23      to the council floor next Tuesday.

 

            24           MR. JOOST:  It's 2011-40.

 

            25           THE CHAIRMAN:  I'm sorry.  2011-40.

 

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             1      You're right.  I apologize.  I'm on the wrong

 

             2      bill.

 

             3           This will go back to the council next

 

             4      Tuesday night.  At this point, I would like

 

             5      this to go through probably more than you

 

             6      would.  So keep your fingers crossed that we

 

             7      can get it out Tuesday and -- not that we don't

 

             8      want to see you again.  You're welcome to come

 

             9      to future LUZ meetings just for a friendly

 

            10      visit, but we'd like to move to other issues,

 

            11      so let's see if we can take care of this next

 

            12      Tuesday.

 

            13           MR. CRIBBS:  I understand.

 

            14           Well, I sure do appreciate everybody's

 

            15      hard work.

 

            16           THE CHAIRMAN:  All right.  Well, thank you

 

            17      for your many trips to -- to visit.

 

            18           All right.  Moving forward, item 6,

 

            19      2011-78.  We have a public hearing scheduled on

 

            20      this item tonight, no speakers' cards.  We're

 

            21      going to continue the public hearing until

 

            22      4/19, no other action on this bill.

 

            23           Likewise, item 7, 2011-110.  We have a

 

            24      public hearing scheduled this evening.  There's

 

            25      no speaker cards.  That public hearing will be

 

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             1      continued until 4/19 -- April 19th, and there's

 

             2      no other action on that bill.

 

             3           Turning to page 4, at the top, item 8,

 

             4      2011-111, we have a public hearing on this, but

 

             5      first, Mr. Huxford, if -- and this is -- the

 

             6      gentleman is here on this issue?

 

             7           MR. HUXFORD:  Yes.

 

             8           THE CHAIRMAN:  That's him?

 

             9           MR. HUXFORD:  Yes.

 

            10           THE CHAIRMAN:  Okay.  Mr. Huxford, do you

 

            11      want to give your report?  And then we'll open

 

            12      the public hearing.

 

            13           MR. HUXFORD:  Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

 

            14           Application for sign waiver 2011-02, also

 

            15      known as ordinance 2011-111, is for property at

 

            16      6600 Youngerman Circle, in the Argyle Forest

 

            17      area.  It seeks to reduce the minimum setback

 

            18      for a monument sign from ten feet to zero feet

 

            19      in a PUD zoning district.

 

            20           The property has a couple of unique

 

            21      situations -- or unique circumstances here.

 

            22      There's already a sign -- identification sign

 

            23      on the property -- or identifying the property;

 

            24      however, it's actually out in the right-of-way.

 

            25      With the proposal here, they would remove that

 

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             1      sign and place the -- a replacement sign on the

 

             2      subject property.

 

             3           Youngerman Circle, at the point where the

 

             4      sign would be placed, is only a two-lane road;

 

             5      however, the right-of-way is 110 feet wide, so

 

             6      there is an abundance of grassy area between

 

             7      the pavement and the sign location.

 

             8           Also, if they actually had to meet the

 

             9      10-foot setback for the sign, it would actually

 

            10      be out in the vehicular use area, in the drive

 

            11      area.

 

            12           So, for those circumstances -- with those

 

            13      circumstances in mind, we believe the spirit

 

            14      and intent of the sign ordinance is maintained,

 

            15      and we are recommending approval.

 

            16           We did have two conditions in here.  I'll

 

            17      read them into the record.  One is that, "The

 

            18      sign will be a monument-style sign and shall

 

            19      comply with the" --

 

            20           MR. REINGOLD:  (Tenders document.)

 

            21           MR. HUXFORD:  What is that?

 

            22           MR. REINGOLD:  The condition changed.

 

            23           MR. HUXFORD:  Oh, the condition changed.

 

            24           See, if I miss the agenda meeting, this is

 

            25      what happens, right?

 

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             1           Okay two signs -- two amendments here.

 

             2           "The sign shall be a monument sign as

 

             3      defined in Section 656.1302(H)(1) of the

 

             4      ordinance code"; and two, "The existing

 

             5      monument sign shall be removed."

 

             6           With that, we recommend approval.

 

             7           THE CHAIRMAN:  Thank you, Mr. Huxford.

 

             8           All right.  We do have a public hearing

 

             9      scheduled on this tonight.  We have one

 

            10      speaker's card, Joseph Sous --

 

            11           (Audience member approaches the podium.)

 

            12           AUDIENCE MEMBER:  Sous.

 

            13           THE CHAIRMAN:  -- from --

 

            14           MR. SOUS:  Florida Career College.

 

            15           THE CHAIRMAN:  -- Florida Career College.

 

            16           All right.  Mr. Sous, did you hear the two

 

            17      conditions that were read into the record?

 

            18           MR. SOUS:  Yes, sir.

 

            19           THE CHAIRMAN:  All right.  Do you accept

 

            20      those conditions --

 

            21           MR. SOUS:  Yes.

 

            22           THE CHAIRMAN:  -- or agree to those?

 

            23           MR. SOUS:  Yes.

 

            24           THE CHAIRMAN:  Okay.  Thank you.

 

            25           You may address the committee, or if

 

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             1      you --

 

             2           MR. SOUS:  I'm good with the -- with the

 

             3      two points that were brought up and --

 

             4           THE CHAIRMAN:  I'm sorry?

 

             5           MR. JOOST:  He's good.

 

             6           THE CHAIRMAN:  Oh, you're good with them?

 

             7           MR. SOUS:  I have nothing to --

 

             8           THE CHAIRMAN:  Questions only?

 

             9           MR. SOUS:  Yeah.  I'll --

 

            10           THE CHAIRMAN:  All right.

 

            11           MR. KELLY:  To the Chair, just to clarify,

 

            12      there are two existing monument signs and one

 

            13      is a -- just kind of a name for the entrance of

 

            14      the industrial park.  We're not talking about

 

            15      the removal of that monument sign.  We're

 

            16      talking about the removal of the existing

 

            17      Florida Career College sign.

 

            18           THE CHAIRMAN:  Okay.

 

            19           All right.  Any questions for Mr. Sous?

 

            20           COMMITTEE MEMBERS:  (No response.)

 

            21           THE CHAIRMAN:  And you flew up here today

 

            22      from where, Fort Lauderdale?

 

            23           MR. SOUS:  Yeah, just came from

 

            24      Fort Lauderdale.  I got delayed --

 

            25           THE CHAIRMAN:  I'm glad you made it

 

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             1      because you're our last item on the agenda and

 

             2      we didn't want you to arrive at City Hall and

 

             3      find an empty chamber, so --

 

             4           MR. SOUS:  May I ask one question?

 

             5           THE CHAIRMAN:  (Nods head.)

 

             6           MR. SOUS:  Could I have my sign person --

 

             7      should he contact the inspector and work with

 

             8      him on -- on the new position, where the sign

 

             9      is actually going to be placed?

 

            10           MR. KELLY:  The location, correct.  We --

 

            11      as long as it's not in the right-of-way --

 

            12           MR. SOUS:  Yeah.

 

            13           MR. KELLY:  You know, you're approved at

 

            14      zero, so it --

 

            15           MR. SOUS:  Okay.

 

            16           MR. KELLY:  Yeah, we can negotiate -- I

 

            17      know there was some drainage issues with swales

 

            18      and -- and trying to avoid having to put it in

 

            19      the middle of a swale was -- was a problem.

 

            20      So, yeah, we would be agreeable to that.

 

            21           MR. SOUS:  All right.  Thank you very

 

            22      much.

 

            23           THE CHAIRMAN:  Okay.  Thank you.

 

            24           Mr. Reingold.

 

            25           MR. REINGOLD:  In light of what Mr. Kelly

 

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             1      said -- and I'm just offering this as a

 

             2      suggestion, is that the second condition --

 

             3      "The existing Florida Career College monument

 

             4      sign shall be removed."  Would that be helpful,

 

             5      to just clarify that issue?  I'm just throwing

 

             6      that out there.

 

             7           THE CHAIRMAN:  Okay.  Is that okay,

 

             8      Mr. Sous?  Do you agree to that --

 

             9           MR. SOUS:  Yes.

 

            10           THE CHAIRMAN:  -- modification of the

 

            11      second condition from the existing -- it

 

            12      currently reads, "The existing monument sign

 

            13      shall be removed."  We want it -- we're going

 

            14      to change that --

 

            15           MR. SOUS:  We're removing --

 

            16           THE CHAIRMAN:  -- to "The existing Florida

 

            17      Career College monument sign shall be removed."

 

            18           MR. SOUS:  We're moving it from where it's

 

            19      located now and it's being re- --

 

            20           THE CHAIRMAN:  You agree to that change?

 

            21           MR. SOUS:  Yes.  Yes, I do.

 

            22           THE CHAIRMAN:  Okay.  Thank you.

 

            23           All right.  Any other questions for

 

            24      Mr. Sous?

 

            25           COMMITTEE MEMBERS:  (No response.)

 

                Diane M. Tropia, Inc., P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

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             1           THE CHAIRMAN:  All right.  Seeing no one,

 

             2      then, the public hearing is closed.

 

             3           MR. JOOST:  Move to grant the waiver with

 

             4      conditions.

 

             5           MR. REDMAN:  Second.

 

             6           THE CHAIRMAN:  All right.  Motion by

 

             7       Mr. Joost, second by Mr. Redman.

 

             8           We'll need a motion on the amendment,

 

             9      correct?

 

            10           MR. REINGOLD:  Yes.

 

            11           THE CHAIRMAN:  You're just moving the

 

            12      amendment, right?

 

            13           MR. JOOST:  (Inaudible.)

 

            14           Move the amendment.

 

            15           MR. REDMAN:  Second.

 

            16           THE CHAIRMAN:  Of the two conditions.

 

            17           Motion by Mr. Joost, second by Mr. Redman.

 

            18           Discussion on the amendment?

 

            19           COMMITTEE MEMBERS:  (No response.)

 

            20           THE CHAIRMAN:  All right.  All those in

 

            21      favor, say yes.

 

            22           COMMITTEE MEMBERS:  Yes.

 

            23           THE CHAIRMAN:  Opposed, say no.

 

            24           COMMITTEE MEMBERS:  (No response.)

 

            25           THE CHAIRMAN:  By our action, you have

 

                Diane M. Tropia, Inc., P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

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             1      approved the amendment with the two conditions.

 

             2           Now, on the bill to grant the waiver with

 

             3      the conditions --

 

             4           MR. JOOST:  Move to grant the waiver with

 

             5      the amendment -- with the two conditions.

 

             6           MR. BROWN:  Second.

 

             7           THE CHAIRMAN:  Motion on the bill by

 

             8      Mr. Joost, second by Mr. Brown.

 

             9           Any discussion?

 

            10           COMMITTEE MEMBERS:  (No response.)

 

            11           THE CHAIRMAN:  If not, open the ballot,

 

            12      vote.

 

            13           (Committee ballot opened.)

 

            14           MR. CRESCIMBENI:  (Votes yea.)

 

            15           MR. BROWN:  (Votes yea.)

 

            16           MR. JOOST:  (Votes yea.)

 

            17           MR. REDMAN:  (Votes yea.)

 

            18           (Committee ballot closed.)

 

            19           MS. LAHMEUR:  Four yeas, zero nay.

 

            20           THE CHAIRMAN:  By our action, you've

 

            21      approved item 8, 2011-111, with the -- as

 

            22      amended with the two conditions to grant the

 

            23      sign waiver.

 

            24           Thank you, Mr. Sous.

 

            25           MR. SOUS:  Thank you.  Appreciate it.

 

                Diane M. Tropia, Inc., P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

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             1           THE CHAIRMAN:  All right.  Item 9,

 

             2      2011-150, is read second.  Item 10, 2011-151,

 

             3      is deferred, as is item 11, 2011-152.

 

             4           Everything on page 5 is deferred; item 12,

 

             5      13, 14, and 15.

 

             6           Turning to page 6, items 16 and 17 are

 

             7      both deferred.

 

             8           Item 18 begins with the second and read --

 

             9      rereferrals, so item 18, 19, 20 are all second

 

            10      and rerefer, as are all the items on page 7.

 

            11           And I think that completes our agenda.

 

            12           Any other questions or anything else to

 

            13      come before the committee?

 

            14           COMMITTEE MEMBERS:  (No response.)

 

            15           THE CHAIRMAN:  Ms. Boyer, do you want to

 

            16      come up and make a statement?

 

            17           MS. BOYER:  No.

 

            18           THE CHAIRMAN:  No?  All right.

 

            19           All right.  Well, we will see everybody in

 

            20      two weeks.

 

            21           Thank you your attendance -- oh, and I

 

            22      forgot to say on the record earlier, and I

 

            23      apologize, we had three excused absences

 

            24      tonight from Mr. Holt, Mr. Bishop, and

 

            25      Mr. Brown.  They were all excused from

 

                Diane M. Tropia, Inc., P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

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             1      attending this meeting because of other

 

             2      conflicts.

 

             3           All right.  We will see everybody in two

 

             4      weeks.

 

             5           Thank you, staff, and appreciate everybody

 

             6      showing up.

 

             7           Good night.

 

             8           (The above proceedings were adjourned at

 

             9      5:35 p.m.)

 

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                Diane M. Tropia, Inc., P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203


 

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             1                      CERTIFICATE

 

             2

 

             3  STATE OF FLORIDA)

                                )

             4  COUNTY OF DUVAL )

 

             5

                         I, Diane M. Tropia, Court Reporter, certify

             6  that I was authorized to and did stenographically report

                the foregoing proceedings and that the transcript is a

             7  true and complete record of my stenographic notes.

 

             8

 

             9           DATED this 10th day of April, 2011.

 

            10           ___________________________

                               Diane M. Tropia

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                Diane M. Tropia, Inc., P.O. Box 2375, Jacksonville, FL 32203